CCJ from Civil Enforcement Limited

Quentin

bowcreek wrote: »

I've now received the claim particulars but it doesn't seem to have any details of what and when did I do or what is the whole thing about? How do I get that ? Concerned of losing time as well...

Also does it surely mean one calendar month I have is from 16th Nov? There are date from October on this paper as well and not sure what significance they carry to meet for paying within a month clause..


Going to post the letter in next post.

You get 30 days from the date of the judgement to pay in full To avoid the ccj remaining on the register.

The date of claim is irrelevant as far as the judgement is concerned

bowcreek

OK. Now the problem is I dont even have a PCN to use as reference to pay it if it was to do with parking. Particulars here talk about "damage". Dont know if its legal language to describe it or its something completely different. Where and how do I get actual details of claim please?

Coupon-mad

bowcreek wrote: »

OK. Now the problem is I dont even have a PCN to use as reference to pay it if it was to do with parking. Particulars here talk about "damage". Dont know if its legal language to describe it or its something completely different. Where and how do I get actual details of claim please?

That is all you get at this stage.

If you decide to apply to set it aside then the CCJ is wiped if at the set-aside hearing (at your local court) the Judge accepts your reasons for not defending and believes you have reasonable prospects of successfully defending the claim. Which you do but you need to be armed to explain that CEL do not use the POFA so a registered keeper can't be held liable in law (the driver can't be assumed and this was confirmed by the POPLA Lead adjudicator, Henry Greenslade). And you need to be ready to answer that you do not know who was driving or that you might have an idea BUT you are aware that you are not obliged to name the driver to a non-POFA complying parking firm. Nor can you be judged badly for not passing on the name of the driver (again as confirmed by barrister and POPLA lead Adjudicator, Henry Greenslade).

Then if CEL want to pursue it they'd have to pay a hearing fee for the actual claim to be heard and both parties would have to exchange their exhibits and witness statements. That's when you would see more.

I doubt they would pursue it to a final hearing after the set aside hearing, because CEL are not looking to lose cases at hearings, just to get payments and default CCJs to threaten people for money. You could then even finish this off by suing CEL for the set aside fee (if not refunded by order of the court) and a few hundred extra for misuse of your data obtained from the DVLA:

http://parking-prankster.blogspot.co.uk/2016/11/smart-parking-settle-out-of-court-for.html

bowcreek

Looked closely and the reference number in the letter worked in the PCN field to be able to pay off on CEL's website. So I can pay upfront if I want now and throw this misery out of my life hopefully.


This would be ----Pay within 30 days - judgement off the register - reach out to credit agency to get the file updated.


Question - If I apply for set-aside and in subsequent hearing win the case


1. would the CCJ be taken off the judgement register?
2. taken off the credit file or would stay but show as satisfied?
3. would the set-aside fee get refunded or I'd need to put a claim for that to CEL to recover that?
4. And if I lose, I take that I'd have to pay CEL + set-aside can't be recovered / refunded?

Quentin

1. Yes

2. A satisfied ccj means the defendant paid off the ccj in full outside of 30 days from the date of judgement. If you win a set aside your credit file should remove it, and if not you will be able to get them to remove it.

3. You would need to pursue the claimant to refund your costs for the set aside. You would need to win the subsequent second claim case to have a case for them to pay your set aside costs

4. Yes

bowcreek

Just paid it off online . Most bizzare system ever for taking online payments. Just entered the details and on next screen it said "Payment made". When I clicked on "Print Receipt" - it showed a database error. Seriously a con company !


Didn't ask for e-mail etc. to send confirmation off to me. But now when I check outstanding due, it says £0. Hope its all legit.

Carthesis

The original amount claimed there looks dodgy too.

They've claimed the court fee (£35) and the maximum solicitors costs (£50), but the £200+ "original debt" plus interest looks well iffy to me.

How much d'you want to bet that includes the debt-collector "fee" and a load of other nonsense as well?

Coupon-mad

Now I would consider a claim against CEL for damages for distress, for misuse of your data because registered keepers cannot be held liable outwith the POFA. They were only able to obtain your data for the purpose of enquiring as to who was driving, no more. There is no lawful presumption that the keeper is the driver so they had no cause of action and made no attempt to locate you at your new address and could not assume a keeper is liable.

For £25 claim fee on MCOL (play them at their own game) I think you can claim £300:

http://parking-prankster.blogspot.co.uk/2016/11/smart-parking-settle-out-of-court-for.html

CEL do NOT have poFA wording on their PCNs and can only chgase drivers, not make assumptions with data supplied only for the purpose of enquiring who was driving. Silence from a keeper does not make them liable and nor does the fact you had to settle to avoid a CCJ, this was paid without admission and clearly, as a result you have suffered monetary loss. Claim it back and more, under the DPA misuse of data argument (I would).

HTH

bowcreek

Coupon-mad wrote: »

Now I would consider a claim against CEL for damages for distress, for misuse of your data because registered keepers cannot be held liable outwith the POFA. They were only able to obtain your data for the purpose of enquiring as to who was driving, no more. There is no lawful presumption that the keeper is the driver so they had no cause of action and made no attempt to locate you at your new address and could not assume a keeper is liable.

For £25 claim fee on MCOL (play them at their own game) I think you can claim £300:

http://parking-prankster.blogspot.co.uk/2016/11/smart-parking-settle-out-of-court-for.html

CEL do NOT have poFA wording on their PCNs and can only chgase drivers, not make assumptions with data supplied only for the purpose of enquiring who was driving. Silence from a keeper does not make them liable and nor does the fact you had to settle to avoid a CCJ, this was paid without admission and clearly, as a result you have suffered monetary loss. Claim it back and more, under the DPA misuse of data argument (I would).

HTH

Thanks. I'd start to look into this as soon as this all gets updated on my records.


I've sent screenshots etc. to County court via mails showing I've made the payment in full on 30th November on claimant's website. Though when I called them to follow up this morning, they said claimant needs to notify them directly about this.


When I asked if its going to be a problem to get CCJ removed from records if Claimant takes their own good time to come back and confirm to court and it goes beyond 30 days from judgement date - they said no, you're supposed to pay within a calendar month and even if they take longer to come back to court, CCJ can still be cancelled, as long as claimant confirms it was paid within a month !


In unlikely case, if they don't confirm to court at all then I can pay £15 to court to apply for cancellation after which they give the claimant to respond to court within a month and if they don't, it gets cancelled automatically.


Looking at CEL's conduct, I don't think they are going to be easy at all even now !


Do you have any suggestions for me at this stage, something I should do etc. to cover myself off?

Quentin

AS posted you could write to them with a SAE and ask them to confirm your payment is received (maybe enclose a receipt filled out with all details and the case number for them to simply sign and date and return)