12k Transfer Sum from Civil Service

xylophone

I think that he/she has specified a DB scheme because he/she knows that they are better than a DC.

A DB scheme can't just be pulled out of the air! And the OP does not mention having moved to a job which provides one - if she had, she would just be arranging a transfer to it if the Scheme Administrator agreed?

Lamentation

Silvertabby wrote: »

I suspect that the most, if not all, defined benefit schemes open to new entrants are public sector.

What are you doing now? How old are you? Is there any chance that you will return to the public sector, in any capacity, in the future?

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I'm in my late 40s. My pension provision is poor due to job hopping, opting out of SERPs, self employment and long spells of non-employment/

There is a small chance I may get a job with a college in the near future and I am targeting not for profit/charity/third sector/housing associations etc) in my job search.

My experience of public sector employment with a government dept was very dismal and the application/testing/interview process of Civil Service roles I've applied for are also incredibly poor, so I don't think the Civil Service is for me.

The college that I may get a job with has this published about their pension scheme "Pension benefits for employees are provided through the Scottish Teacher’s Superannuation Scheme (STSS) a defined benefit scheme, which is notionally funded and contracted out of State Earnings Related Pension Scheme and the Local Government Pension Scheme (LGPS)
Both STSS and LGPS are final salary pension schemes."

Lamentation

xylophone wrote: »

http://www.civilservicepensionscheme.org.uk/media/181376/lnl2-april2016.pdf

Are you sure it must be DB? in the "less than two years" scenario you describe?

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My document from the Civil Service pension scheme says "We can only transfer sum to a UK Defined Benefit Scheme (or arrangement) which is registered by HM Revenue & Customs or to a Qualifying Recognised Overseas Pension Scheme (QROPS) that provides a defined benefit arrangement to its members." There's not much other info on this on the letter.

Lamentation

xylophone wrote: »

It might also be possible to transfer in the Phoenix Life pension.

Unfortunately, Phoenix Life have come back to say that I cannot transfer this lump sum into the fund they hold from an employer I used to work for back in the late 90s.

Lamentation

xylophone wrote: »

A DB scheme can't just be pulled out of the air! And the OP does not mention having moved to a job which provides one - if she had, she would just be arranging a transfer to it if the Scheme Administrator agreed?

At the moment, I am temping.

I do have a job offer with the DWP to start in January but I'm not particularly tempted by it. The last CS type job I had in the past (with a non departmental public body) refused to give me any well being support, despite the fact that the management were bragging about the superb assistance they give to employees with my condition during 'well being week'. It was witheld from me because I told them I was actively job seeking and wanted to leave the organisation, they therefore considered it a waste of time and resources to assist me. Basically I was punished for being what they considered a nuisance/stoppy employee when I was actually ill - 90% of employees there were probably on short term contracts anyway so the churn was always high.

I will be automatically enrolled in the Nest type scheme as a temp which I think is the Lothian Local Government Pension Scheme. I need to register for this online but think it is 50/50 that I will be finishing my temping in the next month anyhow.

Suppose I register with the LGPS - Can I get the CS to transfer my 12k lump sum even I have left it? In other words, do I always have to be an active employee in a pension scheme for it to accept a transfer of a lump sum?

PensionTech

My document from the Civil Service pension scheme says "We can only transfer sum to a UK Defined Benefit Scheme (or arrangement) which is registered by HM Revenue & Customs or to a Qualifying Recognised Overseas Pension Scheme (QROPS) that provides a defined benefit arrangement to its members." There's not much other info on this on the letter.

Yeah, they're wrong. I'm guessing they've used standard transfer wording. But this isn't a standard transfer: it's an under-24 month transfer. So they have to allow you to transfer to a DC scheme. Argue with them if you must. Get them to refer it to their technical guys, with the references I've given above.

I don't think the LGPS would allow you to transfer in if you had left the scheme. Technically there isn't anything banning you from transferring into an occupational DB scheme that you've left, to my knowledge - but that's irrelevant as I can't imagine anyone accepting it. But you can transfer it into a DC scheme, like a personal pension.

I'm a bit confused by the references to NEST and the LGPS though - they're two entirely different schemes. NEST is a DC master trust. LGPS is DB. They're different. You might mean "auto-enrolment scheme" rather than "Nest type scheme"?

hyubh

Lamentation wrote: »

I'm in my late 40s. My pension provision is poor due to job hopping, opting out of SERPs, self employment and long spells of non-employment/

A small point, but if you contracted out out SERPS, it was either due to membership of a final salary scheme (so, meh to the 'lost' SERPS) or by willingly putting the NI into a DC pension instead (so there's still that).

There is a small chance I may get a job with a college in the near future and I am targeting not for profit/charity/third sector/housing associations etc) in my job search.

Any of those might offer the LGPS or maybe (in the housing association case) a DB section of the SHPS, though admittedly being open for new entrants is getting rarer.

The college that I may get a job with has this published about their pension scheme "Pension benefits for employees are provided through the Scottish Teacher’s Superannuation Scheme (STSS) a defined benefit scheme, which is notionally funded and contracted out of State Earnings Related Pension Scheme and the Local Government Pension Scheme (LGPS)
Both STSS and LGPS are final salary pension schemes."

That's a bit out of date - SERPS hasn't existed for a few years, and neither the TPS nor LGPS are final salary any more. However, assuming you wouldn't be teaching staff, it is still saying you'd be offered the LGPS, i.e. a CARE DB scheme very similar to the Nuvos or Alpha you've just left (it's not Nest at all). You'd be able to transfer into it, on Public Sector Transfer Club terms, which given the transferred-in benefits are already CARE, will be like you got preserved benefits in the civil service scheme.

I will be automatically enrolled in the Nest type scheme as a temp which I think is the Lothian Local Government Pension Scheme. I need to register for this online but think it is 50/50 that I will be finishing my temping in the next month anyhow.

Assuming it is the LGPS and not Nest, great, transfer in your civil service benefits before you leave (you won't be able to do it afterwards), and you'll get preserved benefits in the LGPS, so long as this isn't an ultra-short period (refund through payroll before you have the time to transfer in).

Acquinas

LGPS may not be final salary, but it is DB (average salary) and will accept transfers from the civil service scheme. Remember that lollypop men and school dinner nannies working maybe just 5 hours a week are eligible for membership. So it is actually quite easy to get into the scheme if you put that ahead of the job itself.

xylophone

Unfortunately, Phoenix Life have come back to say that I cannot transfer this lump sum into the fund they hold from an employer I used to work for back in the late 90s.

What I meant was that if you had opened a personal pension and transferred in the Civil Service under two year pension you might also have been be able to transfer in the Phoenix Life pension.

HOWEVER, if you are now saying that a DB pension (LGPS) is in fact on offer, then you could explore the possibility of transferring your CS pension into it.

Lamentation

OK, thanks for the advice.

There's been an error on my part. I assumed the LGPS scheme I was invited to join came from my recruitment agency where I've been temping since August.

When I activated it online, using information from a letter I received a few weeks ago, it was for an employer I left through ill health after only a couple of weeks of employment back in August.

So that's a dead end - I am no longer employed by that company but there was no information on the joining instructions that made me aware which company it belonged to and my temping agency had been emailing me about pension schemes around that time.

I assume the temping agency has an auto enrol scheme and will look into that more.

I am hoping to have a job interview or two for the college where I am temping. If I do get a permy role there (non-teaching) , I will look into the conditions for transferring the CS lump sum into the LPGS that they offer.

I have a few months left before the CS will automatically refund my smaller contributions rather than transfer it to a new pension so hopefully I will meet the deadline by getting a job with an LPGS scheme in the near future.

Thanks again.