Holiday in school time - what to tell school

shockingmoment

I'm afraid that we will have to agree to disagree on the matter of term time holidays.

I think so too. My point is simple. We (like lots of parents) take our kids out from time to time. We consider the costs and the benefits. We manage the situation. They receive work. We complete the work with them. They get a lot of 1 to 1 time.

Apologies if my posts appear a bit aggresive. Not all parents / children / schools are the same. The fact that this debate is happening show that everyone here cares. Its the ones that don't care do the most damage.

i wonder how old your children are?

the clue is in the post (GCSE this year, high school entrance exam)

i cant have hols in term time

is this the real issue here?

if you miss these we then have to arrange for a room and someone to invigilate

never been necessary

oh well its only education

thats a poor attitude

PasturesNew

jem16 wrote: »

...teacher would never be finished catching up work of someone who has been on holiday. This time has to come from somewhere and usually means something else has to be put on hold.

We are only back 4 weeks and I have one child who left for a 2 week holiday yesterday and another who is going on holiday on the 28th for 2 weeks. I will no sooner be finished catching up one child when I have to start again and catch up the next.

Yes, one child having one week off means the whole class is disrupted on their return - and the teacher has to put in extra (unpaid) time to ensure that child catches up - AND - the additional stress/workload of managing a class that aren't all at the same level.

Multiply that by a lot of the children being off over the course of a year and that's a lot of additional work, planning, stress for the teacher .... not to mention disruption to the classroom of children who were there!

I'm sure it doesn't make the child popular either - imagine if you were REALLY enjoying lessons and then instead of doing what you were looking forward to it was "OK class, well little Johnny is back from his holidays, so you lot ... er, carry on with whatever you were doing (or fanny about doing something the teacher doesn't have to plan for, like painting), while I go through with him everything you lot did last week". HOW diappointing is that to a 5 year old?

There are lots of sides to the issue. Most of the others involve disappointing other people, letting other people down and adding workloads to teachers.

How can you effectively prepare lesson plans if you're having to juggle the current class, the child who is back that has been on holiday 1 week, the child who is back from a 2 week holiday, the child who is back from a 3 week holiday ... and the one who has just returned having been in hospital for a genuine medical condition of no fault of his own.

Who is the teacher's priority?

I'd be tempted to concentrate on the ill-returnee and the rest of the class. Those who took holidays would just have to muddle along somehow... and it's detention if they disrupt the others because they aren't up to speed.

You can only stretch yourself so far for so many reasons. Something has to give.

Extreme example, possibly, I am not a teacher. But it's possible.

beefcarrot

Speaking as a teacher, I would say that you don't hold the class back for the sake of one child - there simply isn't the time. You would make sure the child was up to speed, but they would be doing the same work as the rest of the class. There are children who can cope with this and are able to catch up very quickly, whilst others struggle. Teachers and parents want the best for the children.

PasturesNew

I would rather travel agents / airlines charged a more even price for holidays all year round.

The price of holidays is dictated by supply/demand. Holidays are a business, people's jobs. If you've got an apartment for rent and in July/August you could fill it 10x over then of course that time will be more expensive than the 3rd week in November when you couldn't give it away for £5/week.

So parents of children create the "peak season" by having the children.

Irony I think it's called.

Holday destinations, flights, accommodation are businesses. They have a limited timespan in which to make their whole year's income. The tourism industry can't subsidise your holidays.

demonicangel

I have taken my dd out for a holdiay during term time, she is 4 and just started reception, I asked the teacher before we went if there was anything we could do with her so she doesnt fall behind. Was told to just read to her and get her to point out any sounds she recognised and work on some she doesnt.

We also done this last year when she was in nursery, the nursery she joined in the Spring term due to lack of places and she didnt fall behind, infact she learnt a few things.

I know its different at 3/4 but it would be very easy for them to fall behind being so young.

I cant see any problem if its done at what would be a quiet time of the school year and you get some work from the school to avoid being to far behind.

We are looking to go away during the Easter holidays and that will be costing £100 more which isnt too bad and then in the first week of term next September. Dd is very rarely ill, had two days of last year due to a sickness big that went around.

jem16

shockingmoment wrote: »

I think so too. My point is simple. We (like lots of parents) take our kids out from time to time. We consider the costs and the benefits. We manage the situation. They receive work. We complete the work with them. They get a lot of 1 to 1 time.

Apologies if my posts appear a bit aggresive. Not all parents / children / schools are the same. The fact that this debate is happening show that everyone here cares. Its the ones that don't care do the most damage.

I can see that you care about your child's education.

My point is simple too. You say that you consider the costs and the benefits. However you don't appear to consider the school and the disruption it causes to the teacher and other pupils.

jem16

beefcarrot wrote: »

Speaking as a teacher, I would say that you don't hold the class back for the sake of one child - there simply isn't the time. You would make sure the child was up to speed, but they would be doing the same work as the rest of the class. There are children who can cope with this and are able to catch up very quickly, whilst others struggle. Teachers and parents want the best for the children.

Yes I agree with this. Most of the time the catching up is done with extra work from the teacher at playtime, lunchtime etc. However sometimes it is necessary to hold back on something as you need the whole group to have completed something before you move on to new work.

shockingmoment

jem16 wrote: »

However you don't appear to consider the school and the disruption it causes to the teacher and other pupils.

Hmmm.

If we didn't consider the school, the teacher and the rest of the class we would not request the work packs for our children. We ensure that these are completed to a very high standard during the vacation.

We have never had a complaint or comment from any representative from the school during our many parents evenings or conversations. No negative comments in any of the regular update letters from the school.

Remember too - the school also has a choice. If it was as disruptive as you suggest - the Head would not grant this permission. If we didn't get the permission, we would not take them out. We do so only with permission.

As I mentioned - we should not be your main concern. We are, however, the 'low hanging fruit'. The main concern should be the regular truants - these are the ones who really miss out on a quality education, and leave school with few, if any qualifications.

But these are the hardest to resolve, take a lot of time and effort but are the most in need.

shockingmoment

PasturesNew wrote: »

The price of holidays is dictated by supply/demand. Holidays are a business, people's jobs.

Obviously true.

But wouldn't you rather have a more even spread of costs?

This is only true, of course, until my children leave school.

Nenen

demonicangel wrote: »

I
I cant see any problem if its done at what would be a quiet time of the school year and you get some work from the school to avoid being to far behind.

This point has been addressed already by others but, just to reiterate, asking a teacher to provide work for your child while you choose to take them on holiday is asking them to do extra work... and no, it is NOT as simple as 'cover pages nn-xx in the text book'. For a start, we don't use many text books and those we do would not be allowed to leave the premises, as (i) they often need to be shared and if your child has one of his/her own then a child in school won't have one; (ii) previous experience has taught us that often they don't come back!

In school your child will be learning ELEVEN different subjects plus PHSCE & Citizenship. Do you really expect teachers to give you 11 sets of work/text books? If the teacher has to make a choice of what is most important and appropriate for your child, this takes even more time. I (in common with many other teachers) do all my detailed planning for the week during the weekend beforehand... it takes 8 hours of planning each weekend on average. If someone asks me to provide all the work in advance then, were I to comply (which I don't) I would have to do two or three weeks planning in one weekend (16-24 hours). I would also have to photocopy all the worksheets I intended to use in advance (I usually do them each evening before ready for the next day), find all the resources, reading books etc. It is also usual for me to change what I teach as I go along... to suit the pace/interest of the children. How could I possibly give you plans for that?

In the past I have bent over backwards to prepare packs of plans/teaching materials etc for parents to take away on holiday and do with their children only to find that, on their return, they have done very little or, in many cases, nothing at all.

The time that I might spend preparing extra work for a child being taken out of school in term time in order to get a cheap holiday has to come from somewhere... i.e. time that I cannot spend on the class as a whole. Therefore, my policy is now that if a parent is choosing to take their child on holiday, I choose not to do any extra work for them... I make vague mumbles of 'Just keep a journal and do a little reading or play a maths game every day' (as did the teacher of a PP). This does NOT mean I don't think it matters that they are missing all the work. I am also not prepared to mark stacks of work upon their return. As a PP said we all have choices and my choice is that if you choose (and I'm obviously not talking about forces families etc) to take your child on holiday then I choose not to do any extra work or allow this to detract in any way from the education of the children in the rest of the class. Why should 29 children lose out so that you can take your child on holiday when it isn't really necessary?

demonicangel wrote:

We are looking to go away ..... then in the first week of term next September.

IMHO that is the worst possible time you could go... It is the week when they meet their new teacher, establish all the new routines, find their way round etc. All social pecking orders are establised among the children then too!