Panic over?

Alan_M_2

BobProperty wrote: »

Barclays was a normal "end-of-day" balancing loan IIRC (it's a clearing bank) not what NR was asking for/being offered. It's the difference between using your overdraft and needing a loan to get you out of a fix.

But even now, NR still haven't needed to draw on the funds, they were an arrangement set in place should it be required.

Whilst they don't have the most watertight business plan I've ever seen they are a long way better then people are trying to make out.

I'm afraid the whole thing stinks of hysteria and is a perfect example of sentiment over fact.

sm9ai

jebervic wrote: »

The Fed lowers interest rates, BOE to follow, cheaper lending and the glut of houses due to HIPS cleared. So can we expect house prices to resume modest increases?

The poll stating a rise of 5% should say A rise of 5% or less

I don't really think anything has changed.

There is still little trust in the sector.

Your money is still as protected as before (Although there is no money in the safety net pot, and what the Government has done with Northern Rock is only a temporary measure and would be illegal to make it permanent). But not many people know that!!! :eek:

ds1980

BobProperty wrote: »

Barclays was a normal "end-of-day" balancing loan IIRC (it's a clearing bank) not what NR was asking for/being offered. It's the difference between using your overdraft and needing a loan to get you out of a fix.

difference?? one and the same thing???

BobProperty

Alan_M wrote: »

.....The companies in America that have imploded have been providing loans and mortgages to Mr & Mrs Trailer trash at rates of 1% on fixed two year deals, the repayments of which have been 100% of Mr & Mrs trailer Trash's disposable income. When the fixed rate ends the payments quadruple and said Trailer Trash can't make the payments and can't work out why they can't make the payments.....

First, the American markets aren't regulated like lenders are here. Second it's more than just the Trailer Trash that have been sold the "American Dream of Home Ownership". There are probably some people who have made money and got out. There are probably some apparently normal people who are now stitched up with their mortgages. There are a number of people who have made lots of commission on the transactions. It is all coming to an end now. (See later comment too)

Alan_M wrote: »

....NR haven't been doing this, they haven't really been issuing sub prime loans in the true meaning of the phrase, they have been pursuing borderline business, which for some reason we in the UK now consider sub prime. It's simply not the same meaning.....

I consider 125% LTV "sub-prime". The mechanism they have used to fund the loans was the same as the US sub-prime market.

Alan_M wrote: »

...... All these sub prime 1% deals have been repackaged and effectively laundered by the like of Goldmans and Morgan Stanley, then sold on to Barclays and some of the larger UK banks. I'd say they were every bit as exposed as NR if not more.

Worry more if your pension fund holds them. The problem is no one knows (or is willing to admit to) how much they are holding and what quality it is. At present, because of the way the housing market is going in the US, no one wants to touch them.

free4440273

fall by less than 5 per cent. BofE will cut by .25, maybe even .50, in october. They have already made a dramatic U-turn allowing banks to borrow from the Bank of England for three months using mortgages as collateral. Bloody bad news for savers like myself (and yes, i do have a massive mortgage also like most): Pathetic:mad: Who knows, maybe even rates down to 2-3 per cent in 2008. CPI at 1.8%:rotfl: Where do they shop? Disneyland?:rotfl:Mervyn: you Genius:rotfl:

ds1980

just summing up the poll. Like all polls it has no relevance or emaning. the people that vote for 10% or less falls will generally be first time buyers, and those that "missed the boat", people that vote 10% and over are people whom have been riding the property crest for some time those that are indifferent are the ones that dont care. Utter nonsense if you ask me for what its worth prices especially where i am in london have about as much chance of falling as america finding bin laden. you heard it here first!

sm9ai

Alan_M wrote: »

But even now, NR still haven't needed to draw on the funds, they were an arrangement set in place should it be required.

Whilst they don't have the most watertight business plan I've ever seen they are a long way better then people are trying to make out.

I'm afraid the whole thing stinks of hysteria and is a perfect example of sentiment over fact.

The thing is though, its very different when its your money. Also as the guaranteed £32k (or however much) has never been used we don't know what it would be like. But if its like any other government organization you probably won't see the money for a year or so.

Alan_M_2

sm9ai wrote: »

The thing is though, its very different when its your money. Also as the guaranteed £32k (or however much) has never been used we don't know what it would be like. But if its like any other government organization you probably won't see the money for a year or so.

There's a reason it's never been used, because it will simply never happen, it won't be allowed to happen by capitalism, the value of the banks shares would drop to a certain level making it such good value that it would be bought out in it's entirety.

The only situation under which I could see the guarantee coming into play is in the case of a BCCI or Barings, i.e. fraudulent mismanagement.

So in reality it's purely sentiment.

When has a bank ever catastrophically failed not due to fraud or related fraudulent activities? The government aren't stupid, they only give guarantees in situations where it's never going to be used.

bendeus

Alan_M wrote: »

The companies in America that have imploded have been providing loans and mortgages to Mr & Mrs Trailer trash at rates of 1% on fixed two year deals, the repayments of which have been 100% of Mr & Mrs trailer Trash's disposable income. When the fixed rate ends the payments quadruple and said Trailer Trash can't make the payments and can't work out why they can't make the payments.

/off topic, but have to say it/

A very apposite and well-thought-out post.

However,

Would you refer to people on the margins of society or below the poverty line in the UK as 'trash', I wonder? Your tone appears to be sneeringly dismissive of those, both black and white, who constitute the 'have nots' in what is unarguably the most unequal 'Western democratic' (sic) society on earth. 13% of the 250,000,000 residents of the US are officially categorised as living below the poverty line, and in a country with notably low levels of social care, negligible workers' rights and job protection, which furthermore is witnessing the flight of its traditional manufacturing sector south across the Mexican border, and which has seen an increase in both real terms poverty and the gap between rich and poor under the current administration, your ill-informed choice of words are at best ignorant, and at worst, plain insulting.

I was brought up in a council house with only a single parent supporting me. Would you have regarded me as *trash*, I wonder?

dannyboycey

The results of the poll just serve to illustrate the confusion and uncertainty over what's going on. Either way, there are some very 'interesting' times ahead.