Asking solicitor to stand down as executor

Froglet

solentsusie wrote: »

Hello

My mother died suddenly last week, bit of a shock as although she had been very ill with numerous ailments, big operations for cancer etc. there was no indication that she would be leaving us any time soon. Although I am pleased for her that it was sudden and not a long drawn out process as the cancer was still lurking around in her body it is still a shock.

I am the sole beneficiary of her will. Reading through it I can see that the solicitors appointed themselves as executors. I was wondering if anyone had experience of asking a solicitor to stand down as an executor?

My mothers affairs are pretty simple and straightforward. There was a small amount of money in her bank/savings accounts and an insurance policy to cover her funeral expenses. She also owned the house she lived in. Everything in total will come under the inheritance tax threshold.

Because it was a sudden death I am currently waiting for the Coroner's office to come back to me to confirm I am able to register her death as I am waiting on them to release her to the funeral home, they should be doing this today, and I have made her funeral arrangements. I just need the death certificate now.

I have done a lot of the basic work. I have cancelled all her bills and put anything I currently need for the property over into my name, such as house insurance, boiler insurance etc. It is just really the funeral to pay for out of her estate. I have set up a spreadsheet of what monies she has and what needs to be paid for.

I am now looking into probate as the house will need to be transferred to my ownership. Looking at the forms they seem pretty straightforward in her circumstances and I know I can do this myself. I have read and heard so many stories of solicitors charging huge fees and percentages to deal with estates that I want to do this myself rather than waste what is left of Mum's money on their fees and maybe even end up with a very large bill I have to pay!

I had a search through the internet and came across a Guardian article stating I can ask for the solicitor to stand down and it should be pretty easy to get them to do this if they are a reputable company, I just want to know if anyone had done this, or if it is something that is commonly known?

https://www.theguardian.com/money/2013/sep/21/probate-avoid-rip-off-comparing

All help much appreciated, but no arguments on this thread please, I don't need to see that sort of thing at the moment.

Thank you in advance.

No advice to give but just wanted to say sorry for your loss,and the last thing you need now is the solicitor making things even more upsetting and stressful for you.I hope you can get it resolved .

Savvy_Sue

I am sorry for your loss.

solentsusie wrote: »

I shall probably even have all of the forms for probate completed and in my handbag when I go to see them.

That would certainly be a strong argument in favour of them renouncing: you have already done the work. Obviously if they don't renounce they'll say they have to check whether you've done it right, but in that situation you should definitely haggle over the bill ...

Hoping they agree to stand down.

Ziggazee

Please remember that your mother appointed these Solicitors as Executors. They most certainly will not have 'appointed themselves' - that simply does not happen. They were your mother's wishes. You don't know the contents of the conversation your mother had with those solicitors when providing her instructions on drafting the will. She may have expressly desired that you don't act as Executor.

solentsusie

I doubt very much that my mother would have agreed to appoint the solicitors as executors if she had clearly known the costs that would be involved in them acting as such after her death, and no such information is available via their website, you obviously have to ask if it is a fee or a fee plus percentage.

In fact earlier this year she asked me to look into how she could put me on the deeds of her house as she wanted to ensure that it would be easy to transfer into my name, although it wasn't something that we got round to doing.

Going through the paperwork surrounding my mother's will, and my mother kept everything even the receipts for the payment to the solicitor of making her will, there is no indication that she was given the cost implication of the solicitors acting as executors. Reading the link in a previous post it looks like the implications of appointing a solicitor as the sole executor should have been clearly explained given my mother's modest and straightforward estate.

http://www.lawsociety.org.uk/support-services/advice/practice-notes/appointment-of-a-professional-executor/

Point 2 - Appointing an executor:

" If you decide to promote your services you should also take into account the client's best interests. For example, if the estate is small or straightforward, it may not be appropriate to encourage the client to appoint you or your firm as the executor. "

But anyway, to go back to my original question, has anyone actually had the need to ask a solicitor to stand down as the executor of a will?

itsanne

securityguy wrote: »

"there are no complications in the will as it is very clear. Mum even named each of her pets and that they should be cared for by me."

And she named the executors. The solicitors. Had she not wanted to, she wouldn't have.

Ziggazee wrote: »

Please remember that your mother appointed these Solicitors as Executors. They most certainly will not have 'appointed themselves' - that simply does not happen. They were your mother's wishes.

Not necessarily so. My mother made a new will after my father died several years ago, probably too soon after his death to really take things in. She recently suggested I look at it. The solicitors were named as executors, to be paid at their usual rate, alongside my brother and me. That was most definitely not what she wanted - she was horrified.

solentsusie

itsanne wrote: »

Not necessarily so. My mother made a new will after my father died several years ago, probably too soon after his death to really take things in. She recently suggested I look at it. The solicitors were named as executors, to be paid at their usual rate, alongside my brother and me. That was most definitely not what she wanted - she was horrified.

There is no mention in the will or any of the letters related to the preparation of the will of the rate of payment for the solicitors to act as executors, not even a mention of standard rates. I think if my mother had seen that in writing then she would have appointed another family member as an executor along with them at the very least. I know the last thing my mother would have wanted is a large, and to the point unnecessary, solicitor bill landing on my doorstep.

TBagpuss

You can ask them to renounce and confirm that you have read the will and are satisfied that you are able to manage the probate, and would prefer to do so.

Although they are not compelled to do so, most reputable solicitors would renounce in those circumstances.

It may be that your mother chose to appoint them as she felt, at the time she made the will, that it would reduce the strain on you at a very difficult time.

If the solicitor is reluctant to renounce, then it would not be unreasonable to ask them to clarify why. Although as beneficiary you are not technically their client, where a solicitor is executor, the beneficiary is a 'quasi client' , which means that you would be able to complain if the solicitor is unwilling to renounce.

getmore4less

Even if they refuse to renounce as you have done most the work they would have difficulty justifying excessive hours.

Much of administration is the time to do the tedious stuff sending of the death certificate, making the inquiries, sometime multiple letters to each institution, preparing the accounts and then paying the bills and collecting in the assets.

As long as you have the documents, statements of account balances, final bills(paid) etc to back up each institution then they should be happy to just check over the IHT forms, collect in the remaining assets and register the house(you could do the forms they just sign and send off).

jstallan

As has already been said it can be done. I did it when my father died. My sister wanted me to do the work, so we asked the Solicitor (who was the executor) to renounce the will. They charged us £200 and provided a court (signed/stamped) document that allowed me to apply for Letter of Administration (probate).

The probate hotline was very helpful to me on the couple of issues I raised with them. Sent the documents to one of the satellite Registry offices rather than London and this was much quicker turn around. Swore on Oath and a local solicitor (£15 for the pair of us) and that was it (plus probate fees of course) .

TW1234

Knowingly or otherwise, your mother appointed the solicitors as her executors. In that capacity, they have a duty to undertake, but can decline to take it up and give it away---as could any nominated executor.
However, as professionals, they have responsibilities beyond those of a lay executor and should act diligently and in accordance with their professional bodies advice.If the situation is exactly as you describe and there are no other factors, the solicitors would probably agree to your proposal.
A reasoned discussion should occur between you and them. In fairness, solicitors and (especially) will writers do rely on executorship fees for their profits. How hard one would wish to cling on to such an item will depend on many factors.
The costs and difficulty that could arise with a truculent executor would only be resolved ultimately by court or complaint to their professional body; the success of such a course has no certainty and places the professional executor at an advantage..