Council tax

Spinlondon

I used to live at an address which consisted of two rooms in a house and shared access to kitchen toilets and shower room.
In 2009 I applied for housing benefit, and following a visit from someone from the Council to verify I lived at the address, was awarded both Housing benefit and Council tax benefit.
I had not applied for Council tax benefit, as the address I lived in had multiple occupiers and the Council tax was included in with the rent.
After a few years a problem arose whereby I was being awarded less Housing benefit and Council tax benefit than I was entitled to. Eventually following numerous complaints from myself and a number of Appeal requests, the Council determined that I lived in an office, that I was not and never had been entitled to Housing or Council tax benefit.
The Council produced a Decision that there was a recoverable overpayment somewhere in the region of £30,000 for Housing and Council tax benefit.
The Council continued to produce Council tax bills.
At Appeal it was decided that I did not live in an office and was and continued to be entitled to both Housing and Council tax benefit.
The Council then paid me arrears, but they were still paying me less than I was entitled to.
Eventually at another Appeal, the Council were instructed to pay the correct amount.

During this time Council tax benefit was stopped and Council tax support introduced.
I have never claimed either.
After re-calculation, the Council paid me somewhere in the region of £18,000 in arrears.
Shortly after being paid the arrears, I moved and am no longer claiming benefit.
The Council have now decided that I owe Council tax from when Council tax support was introduced. They have also deretmined that my two rooms are a separate address and are using a different address to the one where I lived. It is now 155B instead of 155A.
I have never received a summons for the amounts I supposedly owe, though I have had text messages informing me that the Council tax account has been summonsed.
The only information provided is the Council tax account No. the amount outstanding and a link to a website to make payment.
Today I have had a visit from what I assume is a Bailif who has produced an Enforcement notice.
After a little chat he left informing me that I should ask the Council to back date Council tax support and pay whatever the benefit does not cover.

What is my legal position in regards to a liability order with an incorrect address?

CIS

They have also deretmined that my two rooms are a separate address and are using a different address to the one where I lived. It is now 155B instead of 155A.

Any decision on banding would be the valuation office's decision, not the council's. Regardless of the reference used for the address (which is effectively all an address is) there appears to no question that you were resident at the property for which the council tax charge has been generated.

What will have happened is that the council have been told by the Valuation Office that the property has been individually banded and the council have updated their records (which they are required to do so). You were the occupier of that property for the period in question and therefore liable for the council tax.

The summons on which the liability order was based has to have been in existance before they were issued, other they couldn't have been issued for the property (as otherwise it wouldn't have exist for the bill and (at least 1) reminder to have been issued first).

The notices will have been issued to the last known address, that is all that the council are required to do to legally serve the notices.

Craig

Spinlondon

So is there anyway to contest the valuation offices decision?
Or is it the case that they can just determine someone's bedroom or living room is a separate property?

Beyondskint

I'm guessing you don't still have your lease agreement, did it show that council tax was included in the rent? A copy should have been supplied to the council at the time u claimed housing benefits. If it shows it's included in the rent then u should never have been made liable. The liability should have stayed with the landlord.

Spinlondon

Did not actually get a Tenancy agreement until I claimed Housing Benefit, by which time I had been living there for about 3 1/2 years.
There is no mention of Council tax or utilities in the Tenancy agreements.
However I did not claim Council tax benefit and did explain at the time of the Housing Benefit claim that Council tax was included in with the rent.
I don't know the whether the other tenants agreements mentioned Council tax.

From what I understand, the second property reference was generated after I claimed Housing Benefit.

CIS

Spinlondon wrote: »

So is there anyway to contest the valuation offices decision?
Or is it the case that they can just determine someone's bedroom or living room is a separate property?

You can certainly contact the valuation office to dispute the decisions.

They have a set of criteria they have to look at to determine if a property is 'self contained' - https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/council-tax-bands-and-self-contained-units

Craig

Beyondskint

If you weren't looking for council tax support then you would have been liable to pay council tax and as you had no proof it was included in your rent, then the council will be within their rights to pursue u. If the valuation office changed the adress the property was known as it wouldn't change your liability.

CIS

Whether CTax is included in the rent or not is not a point which is looked at for the council tax determination of a HMO (although it can cause big arguments later down the line when court summonses start getting issued). The Council Tax (liability for owners) regulations lay down the specific requirements of a HMO.

From what's been said so far. In this case the liability could only stay with the landlord if the new property is deemed as a HMO - once a property has been individually banded then the requirements to regard that new, smaller, property as a HMO are a lot more difficult to meet.

For example:

Original building has two rooms - the OP rents one room only and it states in his lease that he only pays rent for his room. The entire property would be a HMO as he has a rental liability only for part of the property.

The building is split and each room is banded individually - the OP rents one room only and it states in his lease that he only pays rent for his room. As that room is now the entire property then his rental liability is no longer for part of a property, it's for a whole property. The property would not then fall under the definition of a HMO and so the landlord would not be liable.

As an aide. I suppose there's also an argument over whether the lease agreement is still valid where there's been such a substantive change to the property - too far in to housing law though for my knowledge.

Craig

CIS

To be honest - re-reading the original post makes me wonder if CTB should have been paid in the first place.

If the OP only rented a room within a property then it fell as a HMO and as such he had no Council Tax liability (the mention of Council Tax in the tenancy agreement effects nothing) to pay. No Council Tax liability give rise to no CTB.

Did you originally only pay rent for a room or for the use of the entire property (joint tenancy) ?

Craig

Spinlondon

Only for the two rooms.
Two rooms because to enter one room, you have to pass through the other.
When I first moved in, there were I believe 5 other tenants.

CIS

Spinlondon wrote: »

Only for the two rooms.
Two rooms because to enter one room, you have to pass through the other.
When I first moved in, there were I believe 5 other tenants.

If you only rented part of the property then you should never have received CTB as you never had a council tax liability - the property was a HMO for council tax purposes and the landlord was liable for the council tax.

Even if the landlord stated he was charging extra on the rent to pay towards any council tax then you were not entitled to claim CTB for this amount (as you personally didn't have a council tax liability). Any such agreement in a tenancy for the council tax is purely a personal one with the landlord.

Obviously, once the re-assessment was done then from the date the property was banded the situation needed looked at again.

Craig