Changes to ESA Reg 29 & 35

flyer2306

hi all,
i've been told that changes were recently made to reg 29 and 35 which stops / makes it harder for those with mental health problems to be placed into the support group under reg 35?

Is this true? I'm slightly worried about this as this was how i was placed in the support group by tribunal and with the possibility of another tribunal again soon this is quite a stressful thought.

Thank you.

DomRavioli

Who told you that?

flyer2306

It was some advice site i was looking on in regards to my current situation. It was stated that the regs obvioulsy still exist but are being implemented differently like taking phone calls at home, filling out a questionnaire. I think what i read said its to remove the "risk" part.

It did not make much sense to me when reading it but wanted to check as reg 35 is the sole reason i'm in the support group ( well until the fit for work letter arrives

PHILANTHROPIST

See links below :

https://inews.co.uk/essentials/news/politics/government-rule-change-shuts-thousands-disability-benefits/

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/509031/adm7-16.pdf

Background to the above :

http://www.disabilitynewsservice.com/secret-dwp-proposal-to-scrap-esa-substantial-risk-rules-would-breach-right-to-life/


The above change has been in place for months. It means that HCP's/ DM's seem to be using new guidance to "get around" placing new and existing claimants with chronic mental health problems into the Support Group, and worse still many may be deemed fit to work !! Pl discuss !

flyer2306

Thank you for that information and the links.
That is somewhat relief for me. It does state in there that nothing has been changed with the regulations and the only thing that has changed is how the assessors view them.. Or something to that effect.

So technically as my conditions have not changed i should still meet reg 35 but i've got to fight and fight to prove that.

Over_Here

This is how I plan to get into the Support Group again when I am next reviewed. I didn't need to do anything last time since was placed in SG on Medical Evidence. Nothing has changed in three years, still not fit for work mentally.

PHILANTHROPIST

Over_Here wrote: »

This is how I plan to get into the Support Group again when I am next reviewed. I didn't need to do anything last time since was placed in SG on Medical Evidence. Nothing has changed in three years, still not fit for work mentally.

That will be the case for many claimants, but it would appear that the DWP have issued "guidance" in order to massively reduce the number of applicants who can rely on ESA Regs 29 and 35. Have any members had experience of such new guidance (see link in my post above) over the past 8-10 months ?

flyer2306

Hi Over Here,
Wish you all the best when you are reviewed. I've just had my 2nd assessment which was recorded but it seems the recording has not made any difference to the lies and assumptions placed in my report. The assessor only awarded 6 points in the report for social engagement. Nothing has changed since i won my tribunal, i've tried to tell them this but they just don't get it and want to put me through it all again.

Funny thing is, i listened to the tape recording back and went through the report as on the report he put coped well at interview, i was in tears the whole time and you can hear this throughout the tape. I wish the decision makers would listen to the recordings but they don't.

The only hope i've got is that the decision maker looks at what i have put in the ESA50 and awards the relevant descriptors for it.. But after all the posts and stories i've read i can't see them paying attention to what i've said.. It will all boil down to the lies and made up assumptions in the flawed report.

Over_Here

flyer2306 wrote: »

Hi Over Here,
Wish you all the best when you are reviewed. I've just had my 2nd assessment which was recorded but it seems the recording has not made any difference to the lies and assumptions placed in my report. The assessor only awarded 6 points in the report for social engagement. Nothing has changed since i won my tribunal, i've tried to tell them this but they just don't get it and want to put me through it all again.

Funny thing is, i listened to the tape recording back and went through the report as on the report he put coped well at interview, i was in tears the whole time and you can hear this throughout the tape. I wish the decision makers would listen to the recordings but they don't.

The only hope i've got is that the decision maker looks at what i have put in the ESA50 and awards the relevant descriptors for it.. But after all the posts and stories i've read i can't see them paying attention to what i've said.. It will all boil down to the lies and made up assumptions in the flawed report.

Just gone through DLA to PIP with ATOS who lied, thankfully I secretly recorded the assessment and have sent it as evidence to Tribunal people, didn't use in MR.

Thanks to ATOS lies, I've just spent 3 weeks in the mental health ward after I took an overdose caused by the stress they put me through. I hadn't overdosed for 3 years. Still under the Crisis Team who are doing daily visits. They added a new diagnosis into my already complex collection, Bipolar II, seems I experienced a mixed episode, hence my overdose. I was sectioned (2) and have to comply with home visits and new medication otherwise they'll put me back in there.

paragon909

Over_Here wrote: »

Just gone through DLA to PIP with ATOS who lied, thankfully I secretly recorded the assessment and have sent it as evidence to Tribunal people, didn't use in MR.

Thanks to ATOS lies, I've just spent 3 weeks in the mental health ward after I took an overdose caused by the stress they put me through. I hadn't overdosed for 3 years. Still under the Crisis Team who are doing daily visits. They added a new diagnosis into my already complex collection, Bipolar II, seems I experienced a mixed episode, hence my overdose. I was sectioned (2) and have to comply with home visits and new medication otherwise they'll put me back in there.

You do realise that it is against DWP rules to secretly record any assessment without permission of DWP or the health care provider. The secret recording could end up doing more harm than good, Clearly you have some sort of sound mind to even think of doing that. You asked DWP to look at the decision again and it probably didn't go in your favour, Once you go to appeal you normally cannot submit new evidence that DWP haven't already looked at to make a decision.

speedfreek1000

To sum up - what has changed is the Guidance given to both DWP Decision Makers and Maximus/ATOS Health Care Professionals. It's also removed the majority of safeguarding guidance that use to apply to mental health.

Basically the DWP are now stating; that as Work Related activity is tailored to the individuals needs..... so the grounds to enter the Support Group via Work Related Activity may/will cause a person harm no longer exists except in extremely rare cases if mental health/learning difficulties is stated.

Remember guidance is just the DWPs interpretation of the rules and we'll only find out if this sticks when people challenge this at Tribunals and we start to see Appeal decisions.

paragon909 wrote: »

You do realise that it is against DWP rules to secretly record any assessment without permission of DWP or the health care provider. The secret recording could end up doing more harm than good, Clearly you have some sort of sound mind to even think of doing that. You asked DWP to look at the decision again and it probably didn't go in your favour, Once you go to appeal you normally cannot submit new evidence that DWP haven't already looked at to make a decision.

Once you go to appeal you can submit whatever evidence you want! So that is really shockingly bad advice! It's just plain wrong imho!


As for the recording it's legal and fine. Although with recordings especially of WCAs it's just a record of what was said. It may cast doubt on the validity/accuracy of the produced WCA report but that is it. You need to concentrate on gathering evidence on and stating why/how you qualify for ESA and not dwell to much on I said, he/she said as that will get you nowhere.