Invoice Liability Dispute

Willow26

Apologies if this in the wrong thread...


We had an incident in the communal hallway at my previous home, someone broke in and urinated on the carpet in the hallway so I arranged for a local company to clean the carpets throughout the communal areas.


The visit was booked under my name and the company were instructed to address the invoice to the management company for them to arrange payment. As the flat was share of freehold, I was a director of the management company at the time and able to instruct works on their behalf.


The company has emailed several incorrect invoices addressed directly to me and been told each time it needs to be re-invoiced to the management company and posted to my previous address in order for them to be able to process for payment.


This evening I received an e-mail from the owner of the cleaning firm advising it was going to debt collection agencies, denying all knowledge that I have asked for it to be re-invoiced and stating that I need to pay it and recharge it to a customer(?).


At a loss as to what I should do as the owner seems to have totally missed the point and is unwilling to simply amend the invoice and pop a copy in the post, I'm worried she will progress to small claims court and I won't necessarily see any correspondence as I've lost the contact details for the buyer of my flat.


Any advice would be greatly appreciated!

NeilCr

Is there no way you can get the management company to pay it?

I am a director of our estate and, on a couple of occasions, we've agreed to pay in such situations as we knew it was our responsibility. It was the easiest way all round

If not, I'd write to the cleaning company (keep a copy of the letter and proof of posting) stating your position clearly. In the end you can't stop them taking action (although this may be a threat to see if it jogs you into paying) but you will have clear evidence that you have told them you are not liable.

unholyangel

NeilCr wrote: »

Is there no way you can get the management company to pay it?

I am a director of our estate and, on a couple of occasions, we've agreed to pay in such situations as we knew it was our responsibility. It was the easiest way all round

If not, I'd write to the cleaning company (keep a copy of the letter and proof of posting) stating your position clearly. In the end you can't stop them taking action (although this may be a threat to see if it jogs you into paying) but you will have clear evidence that you have told them you are not liable.

Not the best idea to have a company paying (on the face of it - even if you know theres a valid reason behind it) a personal invoice as it can cause huge issues - both for the person and the company - even several years down the line.

Of course, unless OP actually held themselves out as operating within their capacity of director of the company before the contract was entered into, they may well have a claim against OP personally. If they turned up, done the work & then OP asked them to invoice the company, tbh I'd understand their refusal. If they knew OP was acting as an agent for the management company then its slightly puzzling why they wouldn't just invoice the company (or even both!) just to get paid.

I would perhaps contact the management company and inform them what has happened, that he's threatening legal action and ask them to contact the trader to have the invoice reissued and paid. If the management company mess OP around then perhaps reminding them that they'll be named (by OP) as joint defendants in any ensuing legal action might spur them into action.

Willow26

Thank you for responding.

They were briefed over the phone that I was booking the work on behalf of the company, they sent confirmation by email and I was listed as the contact so worried that it may go against me for not correcting that part of the booking confirmation.

My former neighbour is also a Director and was happy to pay the invoice, it just needed re-addressing.

Im just a little surprised they're going down the legal route when they've not tried to re-address it - I even chased them for the original invoice as they took so long to generate it!

NeilCr

unholyangel wrote: »

Not the best idea to have a company paying (on the face of it - even if you know theres a valid reason behind it) a personal invoice as it can cause huge issues - both for the person and the company - even several years down the line.

Of course, unless OP actually held themselves out as operating within their capacity of director of the company before the contract was entered into, they may well have a claim against OP personally. If they turned up, done the work & then OP asked them to invoice the company, tbh I'd understand their refusal. If they knew OP was acting as an agent for the management company then its slightly puzzling why they wouldn't just invoice the company (or even both!) just to get paid.

I would perhaps contact the management company and inform them what has happened, that he's threatening legal action and ask them to contact the trader to have the invoice reissued and paid. If the management company mess OP around then perhaps reminding them that they'll be named (by OP) as joint defendants in any ensuing legal action might spur them into action.

Happy to bow to your greater knowledge on this. All I can say is that, in both cases, practically, it worked and there have been no problems. The company were happy and got their money and the individuals also stopped getting any hassle.

Perhaps, it would be useful for me, the OP and others who may be reading @unholyangel if you could spell out the issues that could arise and the likelihood of them actually happening.

Just occasionally, taking a small chance (if it is such) is worth it!

OP @unholyangel knows much more than me in this area so do take heed of their views. I was offering a solution that worked well for us in particular instances

NeilCr

I was intrigued by this as it could impact on our estate so I had a chat with our property manager. We own the freehold and employ a management company who work on our behalf. He said that, normally, they would reimburse the director who had incurred the cost - as long as it was a legitimate service charge item. On occasions, though, if directed by the freeholders he has paid an invoice in situations like this directly

Obviously, he can't speak for other companies but he works for a reputable outfit

Willow26, if your previous place was like ours (own the freehold) is it worth contacting the current directors to see if they can assist?

unholyangel

NeilCr wrote: »

Happy to bow to your greater knowledge on this. All I can say is that, in both cases, practically, it worked and there have been no problems. The company were happy and got their money and the individuals also stopped getting any hassle.

Perhaps, it would be useful for me, the OP and others who may be reading @unholyangel if you could spell out the issues that could arise and the likelihood of them actually happening.

Just occasionally, taking a small chance (if it is such) is worth it!

OP @unholyangel knows much more than me in this area so do take heed of their views. I was offering a solution that worked well for us in particular instances

Well normally with limited companies, any claims against the company are limited to company assets. By using company money to pay an invoice addressed to you personally, you'd be blurring that line and where company funds have been used to pay a personal invoice, it can lead to courts allowing personal claims against the director/s (which makes having a limited company moot).

It can also cause problems with HMRC in tax/vat returns or audits and (in extreme cases) lead to charges being brought for fraud.

IMO its good practice to keep personal finances & company finances strictly separate. Problems arising may be unlikely (depending on individual circumstances) but if they do arise, they can be major headaches to say the least.

NeilCr

unholyangel wrote: »

Well normally with limited companies, any claims against the company are limited to company assets. By using company money to pay an invoice addressed to you personally, you'd be blurring that line and where company funds have been used to pay a personal invoice, it can lead to courts allowing personal claims against the director/s (which makes having a limited company moot).

It can also cause problems with HMRC in tax/vat returns or audits and (in extreme cases) lead to charges being brought for fraud.

IMO its good practice to keep personal finances & company finances strictly separate. Problems arising may be unlikely (depending on individual circumstances) but if they do arise, they can be major headaches to say the least.

Thank you.

I'd agree with you about keeping personal finances and company finances separate. I'd also concur that it was unlikely to be a problem especially if there was a robust paper trail

I must admit that I think I might be looking to the current directors - particularly if the OP knows them and they employ the management company for assistance. In my experience the wheels in a management company turn slowly

daytona0

The visit was booked under my name and the company were instructed to address the invoice to the management company for them to arrange payment.

Two things spring to mind:

1. Your name is on the paperwork, not the company.

2. Prove that you instructed them to address the invoice to the management company.

[Deleted User]

Why not just pay it, under your name and then re-invoice the management company. Unless you want to incur extra fees and possibly court costs / a CCJ etc? Its surely not a great hardship to do this, the paper trail quite clearly exists that this work was carried out in the property.

NeilCr

deannatrois wrote: »

Why not just pay it, under your name and then re-invoice the management company. Unless you want to incur extra fees and possibly court costs / a CCJ etc? Its surely not a great hardship to do this, the paper trail quite clearly exists that this work was carried out in the property.

Got to agree with this. As I said talk to the existing directors to ensure that reimbursement will happen.