Cavity Wall Insulation - Damp/Damage Claims

farquarpigmix

I have tried to contact Money Advice Online. Filled in the form online. No reply. Phoned them up left contact details. No reply.
https://www.moneyadviceonline.co.uk/claims/cavity-wall-claims.html

ladysharpey

superbmum wrote: »

As for new windows/doors being fitted - does the CIGA guarantee state not to have this done after installation? No. Is it unreasonable to expect homeowners not to fit new windows/doors/flues in the space of 25 years? Yes.

Chances are your parents were NOT well informed before they had the installation. Did the installer carry out a full survey of the property prior to installation, which your parents were given a copy of? I doubt it. Not a strong case 10 years after the event? Erm, it's a 25 year guarantee.

Sensationalism? This has become a widespread problem which has been raised in the House of Commons, the Telegraph wrote a very honest article, it's been aired several times on Radio 4's You & Yours, it's been reported on BBC1's Rip off Britain (with an update being shown on Tues 10th Oct) and a victim's alliance support group (CIVALLI) has been set up.

So yes, it's a huge issue which needs a bit more compassion shown to those who have been affected and whose homes have been ruined.

Yes, this!! We had CWI installed on the back of a 'government scheme' that was sold to us on the basis of efficiency. TBH we were young and naive and thought it sounded like a good idea so went forward with the best of intentions, but the house has since developed black mould in several rooms.

If we can get help to have it removed, we would like to do that. I came here looking for experience and advice from others as we've also been contacted by an organisation saying they can help with this, but I've been pretty surprised by the patronising attitude shown in so many replies.

sttony

Cavity Wall Insulation is an absolute scandal.

We have been assisting homeowners in trying to get their homes repaired with enormous difficulty.. After skimming through comments, some people have a reasonable idea of what they are talking about - others???? Well, shall we say that I would not be considering their advice

Those who have been subject to this scandal will not take any comfort with what I write, and trust me, you have my sympathy. I have dealt with hundreds of these claims.

Generally, the company who installed the product have gone into administration or closed their doors in a business sense. You can trace the administrators via online searches of the company and view them in the 'tab' details at Company House. You then finally obtain the insurance details from the administrator and you present a claim to the last known insurer (I am not going into the definitions of claims occurring and claims made as that is a topic in itself). You will find that in 99.9% of cases, the insurance cover is USELESS. They have clauses to exclude liability for the very thing that their company deals with;

For example, The Mark Group LIMITED went into administration (google them), and their last insurance policy cost IRO £330,000 including IPT. The insurance policy EXCLUDED liability for ALL work carried out at premises other than their own (known as a Work Away Clause). The insurance is basically useless. Before any smart alecs come back with comments such as, take it to court, the clause will be held null and void - no it will not be. However, if you have 30k to take the matter to a trial to find out - good luck. You will need to obtain a barrister's opinion before any litigation insurance company will touch your case. Guess what? We have various written barrister's opinions, and not one agrees with litigation. However, if you have plenty of money to burn and happy to chance making a claim without insurance - please report back and show us a copy of the Court Order confirming your success.

So - where do you go next? CIGA do offer a guarantee (if you have one. Reiga is another one), but lo and behold if you have made any alterations. Guarantee null and void. CIGA will do everything NOT to honour the agreement. Just have a look at the conditions to the guarantee. They really thought carefully about this and the potential for massive liabilities. LEgal costs are NOT recoverable meaning solicitors will not touch your case as they will not get paid. Financial limits on the guarantee which hardly covers costs the remedial works. If you are unhappy - you can use an arbitrator that THEY appoint !!! Can you see a pattern here?

If the company is still trading - bingo. That is the best start. As soon as you have a good surveyor's report that is CPR 35 compliant (Civil Procedure Rules on experts), you can go after the company. Forget their insurance, go after them directly. We have targeted a number of live companies who pass our letter to their insurance company. Plenty of waffle is received, with the usual omissions about indemnifying the company. With the second letter after acknowledgement, they are asked bluntly, 'Do you agree to indemnify company X, yes or no? You have 7 days to respond. If you fail to respond, we will not deal with you any further and litigate directly against the company..... etc

Companies tend to turn a different shade of white when they realise that their insurance policy is worthless, and now their own assets are on the line.

I really do feel for those who are effected. You live in property that is causing you stress, and I am immersed in a legal minefield of deceitful money grabbing companies who point the finger at everyone else except themselves.

niamhkaty

hi I am currently in the process of claiming for defective cavity wall insulation and I was just wondering how long it took for.the claim to be completed? Up to now our claim has been going on for nearly 2 years and the insurers are denying it's their responsibility, the company who installed it have gone into liquidation.

Mrsb26

We are the same, we have black mould in 2 rooms, the rest of the rooms wallpaper and paint peeling off the walls!! We have been chasing our claim with a no win no fee company for 18 months now but the company who did the work have gone bust and are denying fault! I just want to get my house sorted!!

sbsb

Not sure if this thread is still active?
We had CWI fitted by a local company in 2006 and we're having problems with damp which we believe is caused by CWI. The company that installed it is no longer trading so I looked for my guarantee certificate which I don't have.
I've approached CIGA who've said that they hold no certificate for us and no information for our address. A relative who also had their CWI fitted by the same company also doesn't have a guarantee certificate so I guess we were told we'd get something through the post which never happened and over the years it got forgotten about. CIGA have pointed us in the direction of several other guarantee companies who all say they hold no guarantee for our property.
 I have emailed Cavalli in the last few weeks but have heard nothing back.
So where next?
Thanks

amandaleeds

CIGA_BEAVER said:

I've been trying to post on this for some time now , now I can .

{Text removed by MSE Forum Team}All houses have a cavity wall for a reason . If you fill it with CWI and you live near, or next to the Seaside the wind and rain will track across into your house and cause, damp, black Mold, health problems and property damage .

Because the Gov of the day, trusted companies to do what they should have done, professionally and more importantly honestly. Both didn't happen, greed and quick cash drove this forward. The Gov, informed all installers it could not go forward unless all work was guaranteed, along came the private profit making company CIGA, although insist they are not for profit.

All recipients of CWI, had it installed, because on paper it made sense to have it done, not realising the possible consequences . CIGA are well aware of this aftermath and because, it's a for profit making company, are very reluctant to make redress or honour it's Guarantee ( is scumbags a word for them ? ) Check out who their Directors and investors are . {Text removed by MSE Forum Team}

Recap.
Should not have installed CWI in properties in Coastal areas ( as per energy saving trusts advice ) .
Should have done a survey before it was installed, most installers did not.
Wrong CWI installed to some properties .
Guarantee , not worth the paper it's written on.
{Text removed by MSE Forum Team}

All I can say is , sorry for not being a buildings Surveyor and putting trust in others. {Text removed by MSE Forum Team} Sorry for all the Alarm and distress CIGA have caused us all, who thought you would put things right with your Guarantee .

The only way out of this mess, is no win no fee Solicitors and sue . I'm in the processes of looking for a good one as I type ( anyone ? ) . Don't do what I did and waste 2 yrs trying to get CIGA to honour it's Guarantee . They won't, and send you in the direction of arbitration, which costs you £100 + VAT . The arbitration are also for profit company. They want their £120.00 up front before they'll even look at it. Don't you just love Democracy

So I had someone come on behalf of CIGA today and they insisted blown fibre CWI does not absorb water, was totally suitable for my house exposed to driving wind and rain, and that the guarantee will likely be deemed invalid as the previous owners didn't get the re-pointing maintained over the years. I've moved in 3 weeks ago and have been trying throughout the buying process to arrange to address the repointing, but noone is ever available.. 

However, my thought is that without the CWI, rain would have just ran down the cavity and wouldn't have reached the inner wall? He did say the blown fibre damp and needs removing, despite telling me it doesn't absorb water. Totally confusing, but again my argued is that the re-pointing shouldn't be part of the equation? He also reported that the void is full of wood and rubble and patchy CWI so wasn't installed correctly in some areas. 

I now have to wait and see what CIGA say, but it doesn't sound hopeful and the guarantee sounds pointless...

amandaleeds

tododo said:

I too have damp issues due to lack of wooden subfloor ventilation

Luckily we spotted the problem earlyish - we had to replace one joist and treat timbers and floor with boron

As we were building new extension we put numerous vents to the subfloor at the same time so hopefully the main problem is solved

However I would still like to get the stuff out from a 1930s semi

It should never gone in the first place

Just fired off an email to CIGA just to see what they say - ideally dont want to pay to get the stuff sucked out aswell - rip off

Did you get any joy with CIGA?

amandaleeds

Grotdog said:

We are a chartered survey company who are probably the leading specialists in damp problems in the country. We've seen this issue start to grow, and have known and supported Civalli since the early days. Anyone reading this needs to understand that there is a very powerful lobby - the chemical industry - that funds ciga - and sells all the insulation, through various government 'schemes', which ultimately are funded by the big 6 energy companies, who pay dearly.. Hence high electric bills. Ultimately, dampness problems are due to trapped moisture and elevated temperatures - which of course is what CWI can cause. Properly diagnosing what is wrong and specifiying a solution is NOT the capability of ciga - they employ monkeys who are untrained idiots. The entire system is broken, and a lot of people are having their lives ruined. There's information here for those who may have been affected, or look at the CIVALLI website - or the Heritage House website - look for the section on cavity wall insulation - But my advice to anyone who thinks they are affected - get a specialist in moisture problems - do NOT look in the internet and get a PCA damp wally chemical salesman to come and tell you that a new damp course is needed - you need a chartered surveyor with knowledge. Ciga will do everything they can to avoid any admission of guilt, and blame any issues on things like faulty pointing, broken gutters, high ground levels, and so on... Be careful, do your research!!

Where is your company based please? I had an inspection of my CWI by a specialist company, but as their setup is CWI, I'm told by CIGA they have a vested interest telling me it's the cause of damp and needs removing....so how do you prove who's right and who's not? 😬

amandaleeds

Shroppey said:

Long time lurker, first time poster, I came across this and felt the need to add my experience. I'd go grab a cuppa and sit comfortably, this may go on a bit!

For clarity, I work for/own a company concerned with helping people get their homes sorted following the incorrect installation of cavity wall insulation, so I hope this is allowed! I'll try to ensure any statements I make are impartial, based on my experience and will not use this as a company advertisement. Obviously if I'm breaking rules please feel free to delete/edit/let me know, as appropriate.

Bit of Background
The truth is, here in Wales along with Cornwall, north west coast of England/Scotland and a few other areas exposed to wind and rain, cavity wall insulation should never have had cavity wall insulation fitted. As with many of these "schemes" greed got the better and unqualified, profit driven and targeted "sales people" were left to decide which properties were suitable. Surprisingly, it seems that every door that they knocked was suitable to have cavity wall insulation. In addition to this, a lot of the work done was to a very poor standard. It's now causing MASSIVE problems.

Is your damp caused by cavity wall insulation?
When I'm assessing the likelihood of damp in a person's home is due to cavity wall insulation, the two most pertinent questions are:

Did you have issues with damp before having cavity wall insulation fitted?
If the answer is "no", then it's highly likely cavity wall insulation is causing your problem. If the answer is "yes", then it should never have been fitted in the first place!

Did the damp initially appear on a south/westerly wall?
This is significant due to our prevailing weather, it's often the first place we see damp and mould forming.

What can be done?
Left untreated, you are risking serious damage to your property and possibly your health. The black mould that eventually grows on the affected wall is called Stachybotrys and can be extremely dangerous. In other words you have to do something!

Installer
These are the people who originally did the job, most have now closed down and many of these are now operating cavity wall insulation extraction companies.

Guarantees
Most properties that had cavity wall insulation installed would have been given a 25 year guarantee, usually but not always backed by CIGA, which would seem the ideal place to go to get the problems resolved. In my opinion, the issue with CIGA is that you are asking the people who are going to pay for any work if you actually need the work doing....................Again, in my opinion, the future of CIGA is bleak, it seems they have set aside £18,000,000 to pay for remedial work, depending on whose estimates you use there are somewhere between 1,000,000 and 3,000,000 homes affected, giving £6-18 per home for repair bills..........

Pay for removal
Removal certainly needs to happen. Depending on your property the cost will be in the region of £1,500 per wall, obviously costs vary. The most I've seen charged for a detached 3 bed property is a staggering £14,000! See my comment earlier about extraction companies.

What ever you do, do not allow partial removal of cavity wall insulation!
Not even total removal from just one wall. This may seem like a good choice, it's not, you'll open up a whole can of worms.

Professional Help
Unfortunately, cavity wall insulation is going to be the new PPI. There are companies that can help, they'll sort surveyors etc, get the job done and ensure it's done correctly all under a Conditional Fee Agreement (think "No Win-No Fee"). These companies will also claim for re-instating your property to its former glory, etc.

Do not pay an up-front fee!!

In summary (assuming you've got this far!) cavity wall insulation is causing huge problems. If you have damp you believe to be caused by cavity wall insulation, it needs checking and sorting. How you sort it is up to you.

If there any questions, I will try and answer them as and when I can.

So I've been offered a partial extraction (one wall) by CIGA which concerns me, but I can't find any credible info online which states this is unsuitable. I feel if I go into arbitration, I don't have a leg to stand on, as they've found all the other walls are fine. Seems odd that this wall is the only one with significant voids and debris in...