Landlord late with tenancy but wants us to backpay

Markb06

Hi,

Sorry to post about my landlord again but I need some more advice.

We have lived in the property since 27th July 2013 and have been on a 6 month tenancy up until now. So we renew in Jan and July of each year.

The landlord is constantly late in bringing us a new tenancy so it goes to a rolling tenancy (I have posted about this before). Today my landlord rang and mentioned the new tenancy. I said it should of been sorted in July and his excuse was "I have been out he country" I might add this is the excuse he uses every time we need to get hold of him and we cant.

Anyway I knew he wanted to increase the rent so I asked if he had any idea what it was going up to. He then said well because of the 2 months that have passed I will have to decide how much is owed and then go forward from there.

Now I have three questions.

1. Are we under any obligation to pay back any increase in rent because we didn't have a new tenancy? We just carried on paying what we had been paying for the last 36 months?

2. When he is late with the tenancy he likes to put the original date down instead of the date signed which was late. This time however I think if he does that and we sign it we will be liable for back payment as we have signed it. Should we refuse to sign it unless the date is the same we signed it?

3. He is coming around on Tuesday to "talk" about the tenancy but our rent comes out on the same day. The rent comes out as a standing order quite early Tuesday morning but he is coming around after 5pm. So if we signed a new tenancy with an increase on the Tuesday say at 6pm. Would we be liable for the for the increase since the money has already left? We will pay it if we are liable but not if we don't have to.

Sorry for the long post and any further info needed please do ask.

Many thanks

Guest101

Markb06 wrote: »

Hi,

Sorry to post about my landlord again but I need some more advice.

We have lived in the property since 27th July 2013 and have been on a 6 month tenancy up until now. So we renew in Jan and July of each year.

The landlord is constantly late in bringing us a new tenancy so it goes to a rolling tenancy (I have posted about this before). Today my landlord rang and mentioned the new tenancy. I said it should of been sorted in July and his excuse was "I have been out he country" I might add this is the excuse he uses every time we need to get hold of him and we cant.

Anyway I knew he wanted to increase the rent so I asked if he had any idea what it was going up to. He then said well because of the 2 months that have passed I will have to decide how much is owed and then go forward from there.

Now I have three questions.

1. Are we under any obligation to pay back any increase in rent because we didn't have a new tenancy? We just carried on paying what we had been paying for the last 36 months? - No

2. When he is late with the tenancy he likes to put the original date down instead of the date signed which was late. This time however I think if he does that and we sign it we will be liable for back payment as we have signed it. Should we refuse to sign it unless the date is the same we signed it? - If you want

3. He is coming around on Tuesday to "talk" about the tenancy but our rent comes out on the same day. The rent comes out as a standing order quite early Tuesday morning but he is coming around after 5pm. So if we signed a new tenancy with an increase on the Tuesday say at 6pm. Would we be liable for the for the increase since the money has already left? We will pay it if we are liable but not if we don't have to. - If you agree to it

Sorry for the long post and any further info needed please do ask.

Many thanks

There is no obligation to either sign a new tenancy or pay increased rent, but conversely your LL can evict you.


In essence it's either what you both agree or risk being evicted in 3-5 months


EDIT: Is your deposit protected, did you get an EPC, Gas Safety Certificate and Renters Guide?

marliepanda

1. No you do not have to pay a increase for the past 2 months.

2. If you sign saying you will pay £CURRENT RENT + INCREASE since July, then yes, you do. So don't sign it for a date in the past, sign it from when you sign it.

3. The tenancy you sign should be clear. As its Sept 23rd I'd probably say sign it starting from october...?

Markb06

Just an update on this.

In Saturday my Landlord asked when I was free. As I am currently working evenings and I need to be with my partner to sign the tenancy as its a joint one plus we both want to discuss with him our options I said I could do Sunday and Wednesday as these are my days off.

He couldn't make Sunday so we both agreed after 5pm on Wednesday as my partner would be back from work then.

So come Wednesday we have an early tea so we can concentrate on talking to him and at 18:32 he said I can't make tonight I am out the city (again)

I have now had to arrange it for Monday again for after 5pm.

We shall see if he turns up.

flashg67

Why do landlords insist on causing so much hassle for, what on the face of it, seem like reliable tenants. Presumably we're only talking about a few quid that will be due in so called 'back payments' - why create the hassle for the tenant?
We all know things happen, but missing appointments and not even letting someone know in time is just rude in any walk of life.
It's not your fault if he decides to be abroad when your tenancy renews so he's being a right pain for something that's his fault.
Unless you really love the place, or won't be able to find anywhere else, I'd tell him you're not back dating the tenancy or payments - worse he can do is start the process to end the tenancy.

I'm a small time LL with 2 properties & would never be so awkward & disrespectful with my tenants.

ViolaLass

What a shoddy LL. You are being very accommodating.

franklee

You could suggest to your landlord that you forget the new tenancy agreement and just remain on a periodic tenancy. The landlord can serve you with a section 13 notice giving you one months notice of a rent increase and he can do this a maximum of once a year. Or you can just do the rent increase by mutual agreement and it takes effect by your paying the new rent.

There is no need to sign a new tenancy agreement unless either of you particularly want the six months security of tenure which you are not getting anyway if it's backdated two or three months.

There's no obligation to sign a backdated agreement, really that shouldn't happen anyway. I'd always date my signature with the date I actually signed. So if a new agreement is unavoidable it should start on the date from now that's mutually agreed.

Don't forget to keep a copy of anything you sign. Either the landlord provides two copies and you each sign and keep one each or you ask for time to copy it.

PS You mention your landlord is often abroad, Is he still resident in E&W and do you have an address in E&W for serving of notices? If not it gets a bit messy for the tenant when there is no UK agent.

Miss_Samantha

franklee wrote: »

Or you can just do the rent increase by mutual agreement and it takes effect by your paying the new rent.

Note that this take effect by agreeing. If you then do not pay you are in arrears.

G_M

I don't understand why you are doing all the pushing:

I knew he wanted to increase the rent so I asked if he had any idea what it was going up to.

!!!
Your posts read as if you think
* you need this new tenancy agreement (you don't)
* it should be dated to follow on from the last one (it needn't)
* a new rent should be agreed (it needn't)

If the landlord cannot get his act together to provide you with a new TA to consider, and to turn up to 'discuss' it, that is his problem.

Just cary on paying the old rent, on your current periodic tenancy, and stop worrying. If he gets his act together, fine, consider what to do ie
* accept any new rent he proposes
* refuse to pay a new rent or
* negotiate a rent in the middle

As for back-dating any new TA he eventually produces, I'd suggest that if it's at the old original rent then fine, let it be back-dated (makes little difference other than bringing back the earliest date on which you can leave or be made to leave.

but if it's to be at a new agreed rent, then insist it is dated from your next rental period (October X or whenever).

[Deleted User]

I'm afraid its par for the course with a certain kind of LL. Mine used to surprise us if he turned up for an appointment. If we were extremely lucky, we'd then get a couple of hours notice for a new appointment, or he'd just pop round. And we'd meanwhile be stressing about what he wanted (it was always bad news for us, like him selling the place or putting the rent up or something of that sort). Of course, lets not forget the time I'd spent getting the place absolutely spotless.., never a waste of time but cost me a lot of pain because of back problems.

Markb06

Right. Update time.

Landlord finally came around tonight.

He bought a tenancy around and started to say houses around the area are worth £675-£700 to which I said yes because they are worth it. I said me and my partner are happy at £650. He then produced a tenancy to say £650 but dated 27th July 2016 which I thought it would be.

But more on that in a bit. I went on to the back payment and made sure he knew we was not paying anything he thinks we owed as it was not our fault and only his fault for bringing it around late. He then said (This is his way of saying you are right but I will make out I done you a favour) I have spoke to my family and we will forget about the money owed. I just left it at that.

I then asked him to amend the dates on the contract to the next payment date and made him sign them. He was reluctant to do this but did so in the end.

So to summarize we are not back paying, rent increase of £50 a month and for another 12 months.

Just like to thank everyone for your help and hopefully this is the end of it as we are looking to move next year.