Would you be better of on benefits?

fishybusiness

What an interesting discussion. At risk of being shouted at, I did exactly what the OP is talking about many years ago.

Back to 2003 and I walked out of a 20 year job, just had enough. Good job, company pension, flexi time, all the benefits (like the pun!) of a multi national company except life was going no where. Had owned property and sold, hadn't found a new property so rented, and when I left work I continued to rent, although I downsized as a temporary measure.

Signed on and went off to college for 2 1/2 days a week. Ended up selling all my shares so I could live, sold my nice car, used buses and trains and planned to go to university.

Didn't work out, wasn't for me at the time, moved on and went self employed, so hard work compared to working for a large company. Claiming every benefit I could to keep afloat. It started to sink in that using the system to keep a roof over my head on a low income was terrible place to be and fraught with uncertainties, which I had never experienced before.

Fast forward to 2009 and I did get to university, still renting and actually a bit better off due to student finance loans and grants - was no longer single and had children so SF worked for us.

Had year out of uni just before second year as I was seriously ill, no benefits for me, no student loan. God I wished still working for large company, sick pay would have really helped.

Anyway, finished uni, did nothing for 2 years. Partner was at uni, she claimed DLA, I claimed carers, had all the benefits and collectively we had a tax free income of about £32k. All said life was good, except, at any moment it could all come tumbling down.

It is like a house of cards, ESA stops, for example, then something else is questioned, and put on hold and there is little money, or at times not enough as it just stops without warning. Add the perks of DLA and carers, when one stops the other does, that is £160 a week gone in a blink, with little notice.

Anyway, I came out of remission and that changed things again. Uncertainty, plus the changing political climate and benefit clampdown had us back with home and finances insecurity.

2015 and two stem cell transplants, relying on benefits and wondering how to pay for out of area hospital travel and will the car keep going, not well enough to fix it, back to life and finance insecurity.

Spent the next year planning a business whilst recovering. Then the next shocker, moving from out of work benefits to in work benefits means taking a hit in income before it goes back up. Landlord has said they want to sell in next 3 years or so, back to that lack of security.

When you are on benefits you find yourself looking at which add ons or extras you could claim to add a little bit to your income, and it really does become that house of cards. There is no security.

Sure I did see my kids a lot, and I miss that now I am working again.

I still remember what it was like having all of the security of a good job, paid holidays, paid sick leave etc etc. I don't miss most of it, but the slating the benefits community gets on here is at times ridiculous. Plenty of people claiming wish they were not, and owning their own home for security and stability is the holy grail they will never achieve.

So OP, that is the flip side of your life, and typifies many out there claiming their lives away.

Lamentation

I remember a news article which said Labour, who were strongly in favour of tax credits, had missed a trick when it came to resolving child poverty.

It said that instead of prioritising the solution of child poverty by giving cash to the families that had low incomes, it should have put this money to resolving the issues of worklessness and barriers to employment of the adults. This included putting more money into services to sort out illness and addictions in the parents whose needs were ignored because of the emphasis on passiving paying out to them on a per child basis.

Guest101

dirty_magic wrote: »

Poor grammar is annoying but it doesn't mean you're stupid and have no chance at getting a job! My OH doesn't always use correct grammar and he has a much better job than me, because English doesn't come into it.

I received an email yesterday from the management of a large organisation and they'd put 'please contact us if it effects you' instead of affects. My boss is on more than double my wage and he checks spelling with me!

That's all great and all, on an individual basis.


But the point I was making is still valid.


(I didn't make any judgment on intelligence, or aptitude, just that an interview would be unlikely to follow)

fishybusiness

It said that instead of prioritising the solution of child poverty by giving cash to the families that had low incomes, it should have put this money to resolving the issues of worklessness and barriers to employment of the adults. This included putting more money into services to sort out illness and addictions in the parents whose needs were ignored because of the emphasis on passiving paying out to them on a per child basis.

Entirely agree. The Labour government did do a great job of lifting the potential living standards of low income families, including those living entirely on benefits.

Thing is it didn't change the ability of the many people to find stable employment. The emphasis over recent years seems to have become that those on JSA or ESA don't want to work and any responsible government will make them work for their living. I'm sure that is the case with some people, but many good people are being 'whipped in to shape' by the current system without supporting them adequately.

Sambella

I used benefits as a stepping stone back to work. I was and still am a single parent although my kids are now grown up and working.

I went from being full time on benefits for 3 years to a part time 18 hr job. Gradually moving to 20 hrs then to 30 hours and I've now been full time for 12 years.

I found being on benefits full time boring.

When I came off benefits it was hard at first but with fpay rises over the years I gradually became better off although not by a huge amount.

A lot of single parents make the mistake of staying on benefits til their kids have left school or college then suddenly their money stops or drops drastically and they have no job.

Universal credit is going to change things massively. I think it may be a little too tough with all these sanctions.

[Deleted User]

Andrew_Ryan_89 wrote: »

Back on topic, of my friends asked "are we the suckers?". Work 45+ hours a week, 33% of our overall pay goes towards taxes and student loans. The rest goes towards mortgage and council tax and in the end, we have no more than the person getting benefits. If we lose our job, apart from Job Seekers, we won't get any help towards our bills despite paying £tens of thousands in taxes.

I was watching one of those Channel 4 documentaries and this lady had so many children, more than 6 or something. The council paid for her to have two adjoining properties and then even paid for the two properties to be converted into one. I have so many friends (more acquaintances) who were pushing out children from the age 16, are given houses to live in, paid allowances and if they live in there long enough get a stupid discount on buying the property (though none I know so far are even close to be in such a position to do so).

So, I was just thinking. Am I the sucker? If you can get a house for free, why bother pay for it? Why bother especially when you are paying rent? Working to pay rent for a place that you need to commute to and rest for work? Such an ironic cycle.


Rant over :mad:

1. You were watching a very old documentary...

The one Aired last night whilst the only lucky one was the SINGLE mother... showed a man on universal credit having to wait even longer for a first universal credit payment, a chap wanting a job so desperately even with a criminal record, took a job as door to door sales to the woman of 60 years, quite ill and being forced as work ready :mad: (oh she had worked 8 years ago so a fine way to treat someone and now I know why my brother has gone back to work with his disabilities and home owner status) so please get your facts up to date before trying to stir stuff up with a documentary that goes back to 2013. Where have you been living not to to hear about 'sanctions', 'food banks', 'soup kitchens', 'debt issues' 'mental health issues' 'desperation' for those stuck on benefits.

2. Home owners don't get much help.

3. You are free to leave a job as whinging long term won't do you any good - just tell the boss and they can arrange for you to leave ASAP and thank you for your honesty - as there are queues of others wanting to step into your shoes, then see how you feel and how far you get in the system.

4. Not sure which is more demanding children or benefits. The people who win from the system are in the minority and it's OK for views to change as mine do when you realise their are more desperate cases out there.

5. A P800 refund from HMRC when you've paid to much tax in work is much nicer then ever having to sign for benefits when your in that position ha.

Happier_Me

The vast majority of my dad's side of the family live on benefits and have done for generations. They seem to manage okay although the various disabilities they all have (cough!) probably boosts the benefits they receive. They have absolutely no plans to change they're lifestyle and I am pretty sure they think I am a lunatic for working as hard as I do.

There tends to be one sibling in each generation that breaks the benefits cycle, with their children then doing well for themselves too. My dad owns his own business employing 6 people including the only person in his family that is currently prepared to work (my cousin, who is likely to be person in his generation to break the cycle).

I have always worked and so has my husband and we definitely wouldn't have what we have financially had we relied on benefits.

Another family member bought his house at the height of the housing market, after many years of hard work (two incomes) they have managed to accumulate approx £30k in equity. In comparison, I know of someone who is buying their council property and will have £45k in equity as soon as they purchase it.

FBaby

Most now end up in low level, poorly maintained private rents, with both them and the taxpayer getting ripped off by unscrupulous landlords.

What I see around me, on TV programmes including news, talking to people is that there seem to be a large gap between the type of accommodation people get on benefits maybe depending on the town they live in?

My neighbour is family on full benefits. They live in a nice two bed semi with a large garden in one of the nicest area of town. They are privately renting. The houses on the street are worth anything from £350 to just under a million! They are doing very well accommodation-wise!

Also my friend both her and husband not working for some time. They got to be rehoused when their son got to the age where it was considered too old to share with his sister. They got a newly built 3 bed semi, in a decent area, lovely house with a large garden. It was a nicer house than the 3 bed semi OH and I lived in when we were paying full-rent.

I remember the news features when gas/electricity went up and they were interviewing families who were supposedly the most vulnerable on benefits, and their accommodation looked very nice. On the opposite end, I am shocked by some places you see in those landlord/tenant programmes.

System

My wife is jealous of the benefits people and (though she works) she sees work as optional, and so she has limited sympathy for me getting up at 5:30 or having a tough day

goodwithsaving

Try getting a mortgage without a job. Try being at the mercy of the state, rather than relying on yourself.
I don't overly like the idea that my income goes benefits however in the past few years I've matured; we rely on lower paid workers to fulfill many roles in society. Carers save NHS resources. Those in council housing might deliver our post or collect our rubbish, or move us around a hospital when we're sick. Additionally, you too could have to receive them one day; we never know how life pans out. Think yourself fortunate you will have a child which will make use of the healthcare and education systems; not all higher rate payers are able to have/want children yet pay the same rate.