Am I liable for my fathers overpaid pension

xylophone

Your father returned to Spain and his sole bank account was with a Spanish bank?

He died in Spain and it was discovered that he had made neither an English nor a Spanish will?

An aunt living in Spain dealt with the funeral etc?

You are now living in Spain in your deceased father's rented property?

The rent and other expenses have been paid for an empty property from a frozen account? How? To whom?

Your aunt gave you his bank account details/ some kind of paying in book?

If she was acting as his Personal Representative why had she not wound up his affairs?

Was he receiving a state pension from the UK as well as an occupational pension?

At all events, you or she need to advise the administrator of the Pension Scheme (and DWP if necessary) of your father's death.

No doubt they'll contact you about any repayment - you or your aunt need to take steps to settle your father's estate and unfreeze any accounts/assets etc.

Caz3121

Marcos74 wrote: »

When I looked I saw that other payments were leaving his account. My father had a single monthly payment plan for his rent, electricity, water and phone bill. That has still been being payed out every month.

Assuming you have also been paying these bills then the companies should be able to refund the duplicate payments back to your fathers account.
Have you been paying the rent direct to the landlord? how have you been paying utilities?
Who was living in the property between your father passing away and you moving over?

Marcos74

Thanks all again for your helpful responses.

I don´t think I was clear enough. My fathers bills (including rent) were all grouped together in one single monthly payment setup by the bank (and yes it is a Spanish bank called “La Caixa”). They told me that I cannot close the account nor can I authorize any actions on the account as neither I or my sister figure as heirs because my father made no will (i cannot unfreeze the account). So in answer to your questions yes the property has continued to be paid for through my fathers bank account. I cannot give up the apartment as it is the only home I have and I would have been more than happy to pay the bills, my aunt had the bank book and she advised me that because my father had money in there that I might as well let the bills go through there for now until I moved home. Before I lost my job I was planning on moving back in December. I thought that my father had savings and that was the money that was being used. I should have been on top of things and not let my aunt take care of it!! I blame myself for all of this.

It is a council property and is also in my name. If I notify the council and the electric, water and phone companies that I will be taking charge of the bills could that then stop the payment without me having to go through the bank?

I have a friend that is a lawyer here and I am going to meet him on Monday to get some legal advice and see what I need to do.

If I call the DWP and inform them of this situation can they just take the money out of the account if it is frozen? In order for me to be able to access and manage my fathers account I need to become heir to his estate and that has legal costs which I cannot afford until I find work.

silvercar

It is a council property and is also in my name. If I notify the council and the electric, water and phone companies that I will be taking charge of the bills could that then stop the payment without me having to go through the bank?

As you talk of council property I assume it is in the UK.

Yes. Do this as soon as possible. Also you may be eligible for council tax benefit and housing benefit if you have no income and little savings.

If you father had no savings and there is nothing for to inherit, you may want to consider stepping away from his estate and not involving yourself. That way the pensions people can sort out for themselves the repayment of the pension post death.

Marcos74

Thanks for your response “Silvercar” No it is a council property in Spain. My father was Spanish and worked in the UK for 18 years before returning to Spain. That is why he received a UK pension. I am living in Spain, not in the UK but yes that is a good idea as benefits also exist here Spain.

So as I don't inherit anything then that means I also don't inherit his debts. When you say I should walk away and not involve my self should I just inform them of the mistake and then wash my hands of it? Now I think about it why should I be liable if I have no authorization over his money? I think you may be right and this is probably the best course of action for me to take. How would the pensions people get their money back?

Thanks for your great advice, I am definitely seeing thing clearer now, but I need to chat with my Spanish lawyer friend first. We have a meeting on Monday and then depending on what he says I will take things from there.

pmlindyloo

I am totally confused by your posts, sorry.

Are you living in Spain at the moment? Where are you living - in your dad's apartment? You talk of a council property - is this in the UK?

Perhaps you could confirm the details? Who lives(d) where, how many properties, etc etc

I don't know whether you are talking about Spain or the UK!

Edit - explained - thanks!

pmlindyloo

Most of the information given is relevant for the UK so you need to speak to your spanish lawyer as rules about intestacy may be different in Spain.

As regards your late father's pension the first thing you need to do is telephone (followed by an email/letter) informing them of the death of your father and explain that you are seeking professional advice as regards your father's 'estate'.

This will at least stop them sending any more money!

AND speak to your aunt and find out exactly what has been done so far.

Caz3121

Hopefully the lawyer will help sort this mess out. I think the priorities will be to
- get the pension payment stopped and an assessment on how much the overpayment it
- arrange to pay rent bills etc yourself to stop the overpayment getting bigger
- work out who is going to be responsible for sorting out the estate
I does sound a real mess....do you have the funds to pay the rent and bills? have you been able to put any money away since you have been living rent and bill free? (I know you thought you were spending your dads money but it was actually DWPs)
hope you get it sorted out...it does make me wonder whether this happens a lot, there must be a lot of people living overseas receiving a UK pension and does not appear to be anything to match up death records

xylophone

http://www.spanishsolicitors.com/services/spanish-inheritance-tax-wills-probate-intestacy/

may be of interest although the translation from the Spanish is clumsy.

Your Spanish solicitor is in the best position to advise you about what happens when a Spanish national and resident dies intestate.

I am assuming that your father had only one bank account (in Spain or elsewhere) and no assets other than personal chattels and the money in his bank account?

You say that you are living in your father's Spanish council flat where you are also named as a tenant (?) - should you not be contacting the council to enquire whether you can take over the tenancy/ advise that you are now sole tenant etc?

If your father's bank account was frozen as soon as the bank was advised of his death, why are payments still being made from it?

At all events, you should contact the Pension Scheme Administrators and ( if necessary), the DWP - you may well be told to send a death certificate to each so it would be advisable to obtain official copies.

teddysmum

[QUOTE=xylophone;71094657


If your father's bank account was frozen as soon as the bank was advised of his death, why are payments still being made from it?

[/QUOTE]



That's what I don't understand, as 'frozen' means that the account becomes inactive, so surely no payments can be taken from it.


Also,if the OP is living in his father's home with all bills paid, then they do personally owe the money to the institutions that continued to pay out the pensions, as they have taken what is not theirs.