does the maintenance company have to be honest?

bytejunkie

Fair point, thanks.

On the subject of the service charge, having reviewed the accounts again, i think i've worked out what they're up to. The budgets are built as if the whole estate is complete. which it isnt. Then in the accounts they show what they've collected which is obviously different to what they've budgeted. Doesn't seem very intuitive to me.

What this amounts to, is a payment for insurance around twice what it has cost them. then at the end of the year, there always seems to be a defecit on some other schedule which leads to them using the money that has been overcollected.

mrginge

bytejunkie wrote: »

Fair point, thanks.

On the subject of the service charge, having reviewed the accounts again, i think i've worked out what they're up to. The budgets are built as if the whole estate is complete. which it isnt. Then in the accounts they show what they've collected which is obviously different to what they've budgeted. Doesn't seem very intuitive to me.

What this amounts to, is a payment for insurance around twice what it has cost them. then at the end of the year, there always seems to be a defecit on some other schedule which leads to them using the money that has been overcollected.

Seems perfectly acceptable to me.

bytejunkie

you think its acceptable after 3 years of managing a property to still not be able to work out what to budget for a schedule? with three previous years insurance invoices in front of you?

I don't agree.

If you mean that its right to cover a defecit with a surplus, then fine, i get that. but after 3 years and with thousands of properties in your portfolio, its awfully convenient that the defecits match the surplusses.

mrginge

bytejunkie wrote: »

you think its acceptable after 3 years of managing a property to still not be able to work out what to budget for a schedule? with three previous years insurance invoices in front of you?

I don't agree.

If you mean that its right to cover a defecit with a surplus, then fine, i get that. but after 3 years and with thousands of properties in your portfolio, its awfully convenient that the defecits match the surplusses.

I mean it's perfectly acceptable to budget according to the anticipated cost of insuring the whole estate. If this reduction to actual is a rebate based on a % completion then it may not be practical to estimate that and equally it probably isn't the most prudent approach anyway.
I'm not sure if there's an IFRS relating to a correct treatment so this is just my opinion.

FlyingDonkeys

eddddy wrote: »

You need to decide what your complaints are, then you can decide who to complain to.

For example, is one of your complaints one of the following:

1) The management company are paying the gardeners to do the weeding, but the gardeners are not doing it (if so, tell the management company - they may not know.)

or...

2) The management company are not paying the gardeners to do any weeding, but you would like them to (if so, ask the management co to pay for weeding to be done - and expect to pay a larger service charge as a result.)

or...

3) The management company have chosen excessively expensive gardeners (if so, discuss with the management company, and then consider taking your complaint to the Leasehold Valuation Tribunal.)

LVT is now the first `tier Tribunal. See leaseholdknowledge. com to understand what a complete joke the`tribunal is.

FlyingDonkeys

eddddy wrote: »

You need to decide what your complaints are, then you can decide who to complain to.

For example, is one of your complaints one of the following:

1) The management company are paying the gardeners to do the weeding, but the gardeners are not doing it (if so, tell the management company - they may not know.)

or...

2) The management company are not paying the gardeners to do any weeding, but you would like them to (if so, ask the management co to pay for weeding to be done - and expect to pay a larger service charge as a result.)

or...

3) The management company have chosen excessively expensive gardeners (if so, discuss with the management company, and then consider taking your complaint to the Leasehold Valuation Tribunal.)

LVT is now the first `tier Tribunal. See leaseholdknowledge.com to understand why the Tribunal is a complete joke.

FlyingDonkeys

mrginge wrote: »

I mean it's perfectly acceptable to budget according to the anticipated cost of insuring the whole estate. If this reduction to actual is a rebate based on a % completion then it may not be practical to estimate that and equally it probably isn't the most prudent approach anyway.
I'm not sure if there's an IFRS relating to a correct treatment so this is just my opinion.

You refer throughout to maintenance. You will probably find you mean the managing agents who set the budget and outsource maintenance to contractors.

You are right to highlight the overestimating of a budget when all the evidence is there for it to be accurately estimated. Its a common ruse of managing agents to overestimate. They then sweep excess into some other bill or build up reserves that then encourage more overspending. Its theft and is the reason why C A R L (campaign for the abolishment of leasehold exists).



Obvious Reason:
Collect more money, increase turnover etc
Your correspondence etc increases opportunity for them to raise costs.

Less Obvious reasons:
People can get annoyed, withhold service charge.
Managing agents can then charge legal costs etc.
http://leasehold-uk.com/documentary
Leaseholder runs risk of forfeiture even if they win case for overcharging. http://www.leaseholdknowledge.com/sunday-times-reports-forfeiture-scandal-dennis-jackson-plantation-wharf

Common Insurances Scams - see http://www.leaseholdknowledge.com/insurance-racket
Its all part of the dismal way leaseholders are treated in this feudal system. Who are your managing agents? There may be some info out there on them already. I would take it straight to the Property Ombudsman. Its not ideal but better than the Tribunal. When you are done, post the ruling here for everyone to see. In the meantime have a look at LeaseholdChronicle.com for a look at the tricks of the trade. I would also suggest you get in touch with Leasehold-Uk.com.

Are they a member of RICS or Arma. Make complaints there and see if you can get them struck off. RICS and ARMA are pretty useless as they are trade bodies not for the consumer. Its the equivalent of self-regualtion and it sucks.

Keep a diary, keep organised. If you are being ripped off here its probably happening elsewhere.

I would strongly advise you set up an RTM and get rid of the agents. Who owns the freehold?

FlyingDonkeys

bytejunkie wrote: »

hi,

i own through a mortgage an apartment on a nice estate. however, since being taken into management it has become obvious that the management company are thieves. of oxygen and money.

for instance. their budgets (not accounts) are supposed to be within 10% they say. however they budgeted for 56k insurance for the properties but actually are paying 12k

im not a lawyer, so have struggeld to read the landlords act and see if any fo that applies. so does anyone know of the principles if a management company are supposed to be honest? open? if possible, i'll query every inoice with them to see just how much they are ripping us off.
the service charge went up 15% this year and the gardeners now don't weed or pick litter up. service is actually getting worse.

so yeah, can i take them to task for their outrageous nonsense budgets?
is there a maximum fee they are allowed to apply?

any help is much appreciated.

"Getting justice can be difficult, the property tribunal cost regime is unfair, and there are numerous expensive pitfalls that must be avoided.

Freeholders, with a minimal investment in a block of flats, hold a preponderance of power, which includes the nuclear option of forfeiture of a lease where the entire asset is seized." LPK