Historical movement, non existent reports, near exchange!

dc197

It seems fair that the council purge their files after a certain time.
Or maybe no file ever existed.

Or even with files, the company that did the work may no longer exist or the guarantee they issued 29 years ago has expired.


Seems fair to offer less, but be prepared to be rebutted if you drop £17K (is that 10%? 5%? 1%?).

The current owners may not have insured against subsidence because they did not look very hard for quotes, saw only highstreet ones with their high premiums and excesses, and simply removed that cover from their schedule. Or maybe they thought that with the underpinning their foundations are much less likely to move than before. Or if they did not know about the historical issues they may not have considered it worthwhile to insure against.

Parties03

dc197 wrote: »

It seems fair that the council purge their files after a certain time.
Or maybe no file ever existed.

Or even with files, the company that did the work may no longer exist or the guarantee they issued 29 years ago has expired.


Seems fair to offer less, but be prepared to be rebutted if you drop £17K (is that 10%? 5%? 1%?).

The current owners may not have insured against subsidence because they did not look very hard for quotes, saw only highstreet ones with their high premiums and excesses, and simply removed that cover from their schedule. Or maybe they thought that with the underpinning their foundations are much less likely to move than before. Or if they did not know about the historical issues they may not have considered it worthwhile to insure against.

Hello again and thanks for your reply!
This morning we got an email through from the EA via vendors. The previous owners have been given a statement of the work (new drain, underpinning under here, stitching work) from the previous owner of the house. The vendors have a company name and a guarantee for "works" but the extent of these is not specified. It equates to ~£3k, does that sound about right 30 years ago? Haha. I expected it more in the £8 k bracket.

Well a 10% drop would actually be down to ~290k (currently offered 327, asking price 325 - it is a very competitive area!) - is 10% reasonable to drop with news like this? I've searched the forums and mixed feelings come up!

Makes sense about the insurance; I'm hoping we will find someone who considers it historic due to the age.

Finally, does anyone think we should still get an engineer in, considering we know what work was done but have a guarantee for only unspecified work?

Ha ha. ��

Niv

If it were my house and you were trying to reduce the price by 10% based on an issue that was fixed ~30years ago I would tell you to get knotted.

Parties03

Niv wrote: »

If it were my house and you were trying to reduce the price by 10% based on an issue that was fixed ~30years ago I would tell you to get knotted.

Haha thanks for your input! would the fact that they don't have a clear paper trail for this work not sway your opinion in any way though? If they did then yeah, I can get that. I am just wondering, I'm a first time buyer so opinions are all welcome. I asked my financial advisor though and he suggested dropping the offer by 15% in light of Brexit! That was a surprise to me haha.

ruggedtoast

Parties03 wrote: »

Hello all,

I'm new to this forum but would appreciate any help!

I am a first time buyer buying on my own but with a sizeable deposit of about 30%. The house I am looking at is a Victorian terrace (1890-1910 ish) mid terrace and has been extended into the alleyway to provide an extra shower room and storage. This was done by the vendors who have lived in the house for 4 years and previous owners 20.

The hallway adjoins to this extension and has a very obvious lean towards it. In that, the floor is not flat. The above bedroom is the same but everything else appears fine. There's also been an extension to the back of the house of the whole width which is the kitchen done 2 years ago. It's all to building regs and fine.

I had a structural survey carried out and it showed that the house has had 'stitching and tying rods and remedial works for the past movement which is significant but historical with no evidence of any recent movement or works carried out'. My surveyor has recommended that he can't tell if the house has been underpinned or not but suspects so. There appears to be no paperwork at all eluding to this nor has it come in searches - it would have been around 1988 or before if it was done I guess.

Issues:
- surveyor has recommended that an engineer comes to look and possibly carry out trial pit inspections to see if there was underpinning.
- he said not to proceed without paperwork as to what work was done and the info around this.

I contacted the estate agents today and they are of the opinion that there is not any underpinning or it would have shown in searches. But surely so should have any remedial works too which haven't either?

Any advice on how you would proceed next?

Thanks in advance

I would suggest that there probably isn't much point in instructing a professional surveyor to give his opinion and act in your interest, if you are going to ignore it in favour of your seller's estate agent. A person, who unsurprisingly is telling you that you should buy the house he wants to sell you for commission, and whose main qualifications are tying a fat tie knot.

dc197

Parties03 wrote: »

Hello again and thanks for your reply!
This morning we got an email through from the EA via vendors. The previous owners have been given a statement of the work (new drain, underpinning under here, stitching work) from the previous owner of the house. The vendors have a company name and a guarantee for "works" but the extent of these is not specified. It equates to ~£3k, does that sound about right 30 years ago? Haha. I expected it more in the £8 k bracket.

Well a 10% drop would actually be down to ~290k (currently offered 327, asking price 325 - it is a very competitive area!) - is 10% reasonable to drop with news like this? I've searched the forums and mixed feelings come up!

Makes sense about the insurance; I'm hoping we will find someone who considers it historic due to the age.

Finally, does anyone think we should still get an engineer in, considering we know what work was done but have a guarantee for only unspecified work?

Ha ha. ��

I have no idea how much one would charge for doing unspecified work in an unknown area nearly 30 years ago. No one does.

By all means get an engineer in.
What question would you have him answer?
What if the vendors do not allow your engineer to dig an inspection hole?
You have already had one professional round who told you there is"no evidence of any recent movement". Does his opinion not satisfy you?

Parties03

ruggedtoast wrote: »

I would suggest that there probably isn't much point in instructing a professional surveyor to give his opinion and act in your interest, if you are going to ignore it in favour of your seller's estate agent. A person, who unsurprisingly is telling you that you should buy the house he wants to sell you for commission, and whose main qualifications are tying a fat tie knot.

Very true and agreed! Since my first post there has been paperwork to comfirm underpinning had occurred as the surveyor expected. I wasn't planning to go ahead without any of this paperwork, I wasn't clear I think in my OP I just wanted advice on how to proceed and get that info! thanks though

Parties03

dc197 wrote: »

I have no idea how much one would charge for doing unspecified work in an unknown area nearly 30 years ago. No one does.

By all means get an engineer in.
What question would you have him answer?
What if the vendors do not allow your engineer to dig an inspection hole?
You have already had one professional round who told you there is"no evidence of any recent movement". Does his opinion not satisfy you?

To be honest, yes it does. He suggested that if there wasn't a full paper trail (which there isn't quite) that an engineer would be the next step. I would prefer not to go down this route because yeah, most people wouldn't like their house or garden being dug up. He's away at the moment but if he's satisfied with the paperwork we have had then I'm happy.

Niv

Parties03 wrote: »

Haha thanks for your input! would the fact that they don't have a clear paper trail for this work not sway your opinion in any way though? If they did then yeah, I can get that. I am just wondering, I'm a first time buyer so opinions are all welcome. I asked my financial advisor though and he suggested dropping the offer by 15% in light of Brexit! That was a surprise to me haha.

Well no, it wouldn't bother me too much as you have said your surveyor has said it hasn't moved in 25-30 years and you seem to subsequently know it has been underpinned. What more can the piece of paper do to reassure you?

If you want to get a structural engineer in to verify what your structural surveyor has already told you fair enough - from the information you have given I don't expect you to receive a different response, afterall a trial pit is just that - a trial - so if the underpinning wasn't as extensive as you think there is only a small chance of you finding out ALOS, your surveyor has already told you there has been no recent movement so what difference does it really make if it is underpinned or not? It seems clear that any issue is historic.

Lowering your offer due to Brexit is a totally different kettle of fish, which I am not interested in getting involved in as I personally do not believe that over the medium term there will be any significant downturn in house prices.

Parties03

Niv wrote: »

Well no, it wouldn't bother me too much as you have said your surveyor has said it hasn't moved in 25-30 years and you seem to subsequently know it has been underpinned. What more can the piece of paper do to reassure you?

If you want to get a structural engineer in to verify what your structural surveyor has already told you fair enough - from the information you have given I don't expect you to receive a different response, afterall a trial pit is just that - a trial - so if the underpinning wasn't as extensive as you think there is only a small chance of you finding out ALOS, your surveyor has already told you there has been no recent movement so what difference does it really make if it is underpinned or not? It seems clear that any issue is historic.

Lowering your offer due to Brexit is a totally different kettle of fish, which I am not interested in getting involved in as I personally do not believe that over the medium term there will be any significant downturn in house prices.

Fair comments. I am a first time buyer; I am being over cautious for a reason. This is a significant purchase for me and I am only questioning things to make sure I don't miss something, more so because I'm going for a Victorian mid terrace where issues are possible.

Thanks for your advice though, what you say makes sense.