Deducting damage costs from Tenants deposit?

PrincessJR

Hi,

We have a rental property which we rent out through a letting agent.

Our tenants moved out on June 15th leaving some damage which will need addressing. The letting agent carried out the inspection on 15th and signed it off (!?) it was only when we visited on 18th that the issues became apparent.

The letting agent has advised us to either do the repairs ourself and send her the bill, or they will send a handyman - I do not trust the quality of work by their handyman!

My question is, if we set about doing the repairs/replacements ourselves, apart from sending receipts for products purchased, how/can we take into account our time for doing this?

For example I spent 5 hours deep cleaning the house yesterday as it had been left filthy. I know now that if I had hired a cleaning company I could have submitted the bill but we had viewing and so it had to be cleaned straight away.

Any advice appreciated

Jayne

tlc678910

It would be interesting to know what you feel needs doing considering the agent felt the property was left in a satisfactory state.

It sounds like your standards might be quite high - as you are not satisfied with the work of the people the letting agents engage?

If you were able to "deep clean" the property in 5 hours it sounds to me like while the tenants may not have left the property perfect it was possibly acceptable/mediocre?

Is it worth the agro (say to charge 5 x £10 per hour for cleaning) which will likely be disputed (particularly as the agents were happy with it) or just be grateful for what was (?) a reasonable letting experience and move on?

Tlc

[Deleted User]

Did you take photos of the property and dirt/damage?

Was the deposit protected?

If the LA signed off the property, you have no proof the damage exists or cleaning was needed. So if the tenant disputes the deposit deductions, you will find it difficult to defend the deductions.

If the deposit was protected, you need to let your tenant know what deductions you are intending to take, then apply for those deductions from whichever scheme the deposit is protected with.

Have you spoken to the LA about the situation - asked why they signed the property off but you found damage and a need for a deep clean? A deep clean normally implies cleaning the oven, kitchen cupboards, walls, skirting boards, and probably a carpet shampoo/steam. Five hours does seem a bit short for that.

PrincessJR

Yes we took photographs which we've sent to the agent.

One of the glass bathroom light fittings had been broken and the damaged section simply rested on top to hide the damage.

One of the bedroom doors had a hole punched in it

There was a hole in the wall behind the bathroom door when the door had obviously been swung open with force.

The had clearly had a cat when the property was let on the agreement of no pets. The cat has pulled the lounge carpet and scratched the UPVC rear glass door and sealer.

The Oven hood, hob and internal ovens were thick with grease and required a professional steam clean

We absolutely understand wear and tear, but in this instance, the agent obviously did NOT do a thorough check of the property, and these issues we feel were unacceptable.

HappyMJ

PrincessJR wrote: »

Hi,

We have a rental property which we rent out through a letting agent.

Our tenants moved out on June 15th leaving some damage which will need addressing. The letting agent carried out the inspection on 15th and signed it off (!?) it was only when we visited on 18th that the issues became apparent.

The letting agent has advised us to either do the repairs ourself and send her the bill, or they will send a handyman - I do not trust the quality of work by their handyman!

My question is, if we set about doing the repairs/replacements ourselves, apart from sending receipts for products purchased, how/can we take into account our time for doing this?

For example I spent 5 hours deep cleaning the house yesterday as it had been left filthy. I know now that if I had hired a cleaning company I could have submitted the bill but we had viewing and so it had to be cleaned straight away.

Any advice appreciated

Jayne

Fair wear and tear? What was intentionally or accidentally damaged by the tenant? If it's cheap low quality items that were damaged even accidentally then the tenant can claim fair wear and tear and you get nothing.

Deep cleaning the property is not required by the tenants who are leaving. As long as it looks relatively clean then it's good enough and you can't claim anything. It's now quite difficult to get money from a tenant for cleaning costs. You would need pictures of the filth left and pictures of the perfect state of the property before it was let would also be required.

PrincessJR

HappyMJ wrote: »

Fair wear and tear? What was intentionally or accidentally damaged by the tenant? If it's cheap low quality items that were damaged even accidentally then the tenant can claim fair wear and tear and you get nothing.

Deep cleaning the property is not required by the tenants who are leaving. As long as it looks relatively clean then it's good enough and you can't claim anything. It's now quite difficult to get money from a tenant for cleaning costs. You would need pictures of the filth left and pictures of the perfect state of the property before it was let would also be required.

Thanks. Yes we have both. When the property was let, the agent completed a report with photos which showed it was clean and their description of each area was "Cleaned to a professional standard".

I took photos throughout when we went to check it and it had not been cleaned. In my appraisal of the houses condition I am referring to the agents original report and tenants agreement which states that tenants should leave the property as they found it, including where needed, cleaning carpets etc.

I don't think a hole in a bedroom door is acceptable as wear and tear?

The tenants agreement also states they should leave the oven clean. It was thick with grease and food debris - clearly the agent did not check it.

I've emailed our photographs to the agent who has advised we either complete the work ourselves and let her know the cost, or she will send a handyman. My original question was relating to us doing the work ourselves - I think its clear that we're better off organising our own contractors to come and do the repairs and replacements, then forward the invoices.

HappyMJ

PrincessJR wrote: »

Yes we took photographs which we've sent to the agent.

One of the glass bathroom light fittings had been broken and the damaged section simply rested on top to hide the damage.

One of the bedroom doors had a hole punched in it

There was a hole in the wall behind the bathroom door when the door had obviously been swung open with force.

The had clearly had a cat when the property was let on the agreement of no pets. The cat has pulled the lounge carpet and scratched the UPVC rear glass door and sealer.

The Oven hood, hob and internal ovens were thick with grease and required a professional steam clean

We absolutely understand wear and tear, but in this instance, the agent obviously did NOT do a thorough check of the property, and these issues we feel were unacceptable.

That's not that bad. I'd just get on with repairing and cleaning it and move on.

The hole in the door should have been something that the agent should have picked up on but they've signed releasing the deposit off so to get anything you've now got to take the tenant to court.

They would not have noticed the light fitting or the hole in the wall behind an open door. It's a quick inspection for obvious things not a meticulous inspection.

The time spent taking the former tenant to court over such a small sum is much more valuable to me.

[Deleted User]

Professional steam clean- you will have a bill surely? A quick scrub doesn't count. Steam cleaning often isn't that good with long standing oven/hob grime. You need to clean with acids to remove that kind of thing. Food particles, while unpleasant and needing cleaning, aren't overly difficult to scrub away.

If you get someone in to repair the dent in the wall (and put a door stopper by the wall) and repaint, repair the hole in the door. You will have a bill.

The light fitting presumably needs replacement and refitting. You should have a bill for that but how much of the bill you will get depends on how old the light fitting is (ie. if brand new when the tenants moved in say a year ago, you'd get almost all of the replacement costs back. If ten years old, you won't). This is called betterment. Same for the carpet. Get an estimate of replacement costs for an equivalent but any award will depend on how old the carpet was.

So, you will need to at least get estimates for the damage repair/cleaning or replacement and present them to wherever the deposit is protected. Any award may well include deductions to prevent betterment. If money is awarded it doesn't matter (legally) if the repairs are done by yourself a professional or not at all. The money is to compensate you for the damage caused.

But I am afraid, I do agree that the sort of costs you are talking about seem to be more the costs of renting rather than really high costs its worth going through the reclaiming process for.

nkkingston

If the letting agency screwed up, wouldn't they be responsible for covering the damages now rather than the tenant? They've told the tenant it's all fine, after all, so the tenant has a reasonable expectation of getting their deposit back. This might be why they're offering to hire a handyman for you.

tlc678910

Hi,
Claiming for the light fitting, door, wall repair and oven clean sounds reasonable if you have the evidence.

For the carpet damage you can claim what amounts to a portion of the cost of the (used) carpet - so don't submit a claim for the full cost of a new carpet else it won't succeed (at arbitration by the deposit scheme I mean).

You can attempt to claim for your time using a calculation you think is reasonable. If it is disputed the deposit scheme will decide.

Good luck with it.

If your claim does not all succeed, although it is disappointing for you to have damage to your property, a cost of £500 - £1000 to do repairs and spruce up between tenants is pretty typical in my opinion.

Tlc

G_M

Has the agent actually released the deposit yet?

If so, your have 2 options. Use the courts (moneyclaim online) to

* sue the tenants for the damage or
* sue the agent for failing to do their job properly

hole in a door is clearly not fair wear and tear, and nor is a broken light fitting. Cleaning depends entirely on what it looked like at the start of the tenancy compared to the end, and the evidence you have.

If the tenants have received ay documentation from the agent that the property was left 'OK' (or have received their deposit back in full, which implies the same thing) that will be evidence that they will doubtless present to a court, suggesting you are acting unfairly. Not insurmountable if you have oter evidence, but a risk.

If the deposit has not been returned, instruct the agent to contat the tenant asap with the amount you plan to deduct. Attach written quotes/estimates to justify the amounts.

Cleaning yourself was a mistake - you should have got a cleaning company to quote for the work. You could try claiming minimum wage for yourself which the arbitrator might accept.