Flexible contract and my rights

sangie595

Deleted%20User wrote: »

Ugh ask for the day shift, it seems that pattern can't give people the hours wanted and that's whether you were there for 2 or 12 years, but still nothing would dare get said to someone who for 12 years solid, refused to help themselves by refusal ever of working a night shift and oh played the hard done by card nonetheless and and so the stick you are receiving is particularly harsh, perhaps that's why there is so much angst at T : (

This makes no sense at all.

The OP is on a contract that says that they work when they are told. So if they are there for 12 years they still work when they are told. There is nothing harsh at all in being asked to do extra shifts. It is a contractual condition and the OP is entitled to refuse. And the employer is entitled to get rid of them. If this is not acceptable to the OP, they have an option - quit.

McKneff

You cant possibly pay your own way rent, utilities etc among a hundred other things
on 15 hours a week

Do you receive any benefits to top it up.

BadBehaviour

Yes, I wanted more hours than 15 (that was at the start when I hadn't experienced how it is working lots of nights in a row). I'm not quitting even if I am struggling with this job.

I thought of getting a bike from the station there to the workplace. At the moment on certain days I don't have time to even eat dinner before going to work because I sleep and when I wake up I have to get ready to get the train and I get there an hour early because of train times. Can't bike all the way from where I live as I live 30 minutes away on the train. I'd be knackered before I even start working. Oh and at least I get free travel on the train (not because of Tesco though).

I am ok with 4 nights a week. Realistically I can't work more than that without giving up my life completely. I don't have time to do anything at all as it is. I need the money yes but I am not a slave. This was my 6th night in a row and they wanted me to go in tonight as well.
I am doing all the hours they ask. It' not like I am refusing to do them. It's a temp contract of a few months so they must have foreseen needing someone to cover lots of shifts in that time frame. They gave me a contract of 15 hours, which means I wouldn't pass the referencing with an estate agent (also it's a temp contract only) when really I have been working full time all the time since I started and will in the next few weeks as well (been given my shifts chart). They led me to believe that I will get a permanent contract if I never go sick and always turn up.

When I said if I had wanted a full time job etc it was more to say that for all they know I applied for a part time job because I want to do few hours and not work full time like it's happening.

I live with someone who works full time on a good salary and pays rent etc so no, not claiming any benefits, but I want to move out and I'd be ok looking for a place if I had a contract that says I work 4 nights a week. I'm also a freelancer so I can top up my money if needed that way (at the moment I don't have time to do that either).

I am not quitting or refusing the hours as I don't want to be left with no job, but it seems like they want a slave at their beck and call really. They make it sound like flexible working is to suit the employee just as much as them but it's a one way thing as you have pointed out. They can have you as their slave when it suits them and leave you with the minimum hours they can give when they don't need you. By the way the contract states they can get rid of me sooner if they don't need me anymore, so they can basically do as they like.

I'm sure there are lots of people in the world who work the most terrible hours in the most terrible conditions because they need the money but that doesn't mean someone is wrong if they don't want to sacrifice their life to a job.

As it is I don't have any guarantees I will be kept on at the end of my contract and I work so much I don't have much time to look for and interview for another job in case they get rid of me. They'd better not seeing as I have always turned up and always work the hours they ask me to work.

Basically I decided that I might as well take all the money I can for the moment and suck it up.

eschaton

BadBehaviour wrote: »

I am ok with 4 nights a week. Realistically I can't work more than that without giving up my life completely.

There are 7 nights/days in a week.

When you said you could work any days or hours they maybe believed you.

Do you think that everyone who works full time has no life?

bartelbe

It is annoying? This country is full of people who will work themselves to death for f**k all. So employers have come to expect one way flexibility.

I have been in a similar situation and I refused to works hours I didn't want. They didn't sack me, they just didn't hire me after the temp contract. Since they were s**t employers, I didn't really care.

bartelbe

sangie595 wrote: »

This makes no sense at all.

The OP is on a contract that says that they work when they are told. So if they are there for 12 years they still work when they are told. There is nothing harsh at all in being asked to do extra shifts. It is a contractual condition and the OP is entitled to refuse. And the employer is entitled to get rid of them. If this is not acceptable to the OP, they have an option - quit.

Which means there are zero protections for people who don't want to work excessive hours. Want a full time employee? Then hire and pay for one.

BadBehaviour

takman wrote: »

Maybe you should buy a bike then you won't have to waste money on paying for taxis.

Plus is there any reason why you don't want to work more than 15 hours a week especially as pmlindyloo pointed out in your other thread you wanted all the hours under the sun to get some extra money.

I thought I'd do my contracted 15 hours and occasionally and if I wanted to I could do more hours if they were available since they go on about this flexi contract suiting the lifestyle of every employee they have. I also knew they could ask me to work when they needed me to work overtime. Overtime for me is occasional, not regular; otherwise if you have those extra hours regularly available, just contract me for more bl@@dy hours from the start. Not the point that I wanted to do more than 15 hours from the start. It's a matter of principle that they knew they would need me for more than 15 hours every week and they only gave me a contract where officially I appear to be doing just 15 hours a week. They hired temp staff because they knew they had lots of extra work after all.
This has become a problem now because I found out estate agents don't consider overtime during the referencing, so for them I only earn proportionally to 15 hours a week and would never let me rent, forcing me to offer to pay all the rent upfront to have a chance at renting while I wait for a new job with more security and contracted hours.

Yesterday for example I was asked if I could go in today, my rest day, instead of Thursday (which is one of the 2 days I am contracted to work on) and by contract they have to give me 24 notice. I was asked almost at the end of the night.

As I said I am working nights, many nights in a row with a day off only after. On my day off I have to sleep after a night's work. I think people working 9 to 5 in an office full time for example get the weekend off and they don't need to spend their day off sleeping, so yes, they have more of a life that I can have at the moment. I am telling you I don't even have the time to eat before work on some days where I am tired and achy and I wake up later.

Also I was given my contract about 3 weeks after starting so I never knew for example that they could get rid of me before the contract ends if the need for temp staff decreases.

sangie595

bartelbe wrote: »

Which means there are zero protections for people who don't want to work excessive hours. Want a full time employee? Then hire and pay for one.

Pardon? There are quite a few protections for people who don't want to work excessive hours. Working a full-time job, even if that was what the OP was doing, is not deemed excessive in anyone's book. And since they are paying for all the hours, they are paying for what the OP works - it isn't slavery.

I am afraid that the OP seems to have an unrealistic view of working life. Didn't know that they can be dismissed if the employer doesn't need them any more? That would be everyone on any kind of contract! For the first two years it is called dismissed, and after that it is called redundancy. And it isn't the employers fault that estate agents operate on guaranteed hours and not including overtime. The OP has been there for a few weeks, and it seems that it might be a busy period. Not surprising perhaps given that half term fell in those few weeks, and a fair few parents may have been on holiday. But regardless, the OP said that they wanted the hours, and they have been offered them. They are at liberty to refuse them. If that then means that extra shifts aren't offered to them, or they are let go in favour of more flexible workers, then it is what it is. This is a sector of work that is very flexible even with full-time workers because shifts need to change to respond to business needs. It may not be the best job in the world, but nor is it the worst. But if it doesn't suit the OP then they are entitled to leave.

OP - it may be that you are simply not used to working since you have only been there a few weeks and you give the impression that you may not have been employed previous to this. But if you are so tired after a normal shift at work (these aren't long shifts if 15 hours is 2 shifts) that you need to sleep the entire of the next day and don't even get time to eat, then I suggest you see your doctor. Assuming a 7.5 hour shift per day, plus some travel time, that suggests you are sleeping in excess of 14 / 15 hours per day. That certainly isn't normal.

autumn2012_2

Unfortunately they will just replace you if you wont do the overtime. They will just hire somebody who will work whenever they want. I work part time and I dont want any more hours. I couldnt manage a full time job with 2 young kids. Alot of employers are the same these days - no rights, horrendous conditions etc. My husbands employers (national firm) wont even let them have drinks on the shop floor during hot weather! Its ridiculous but the way it is. You either get something else or suck it up. I was working as an !!! manager last year on NMW - kept getting promised a rise (btw wasnt my performance as I am very good at my job) but employer wouldnt pay so I left and got a part time job with no hassle.

Rosemary7391

Perhaps I'm missing it, but have you tried actually saying you'd rather not? I know not all managers are sensible people, but most would understand not wanting to work 6 nights in a row. If they ask and you always say yes, they could genuinely think you're happy to take on the extra hours.