Voluntary Termination With BMW

blackste

bigjl wrote: »

So this was a PCP? Why did you allow them to put an unrealistic mileage on the contract? Or did you do that to make the monthly payments less?

Not an issue if you intended to keep the car but how is an issue?

Never been given a mileage restriction on a car on HP.

Putting a low agreed mileage on deals is very common practice within the industry. It lets them shift cars with low monthly payments, and sales people will advise people to do it, and VT later.

K_Fergy

As a follow up to my previous posts regarding my termination with BMW, I recently received a final response letter from them basically outlining that I still owe them for the excess mileage and if I want to continue my complaint I must do so to the financial ombudsman service within 6 months of the date of this letter. Here is the text from the letter.

Thank you for your recent email regarding the Excess Mileage invoice raised on your
agreement. Having reviewed your agreement details, please allow me to explain our final
position why the invoice for excess mileage remains payable.
At the beginning of your agreement you gave us a predicted annual mileage of 8,000 miles
per annum. In turn we therefore expected the vehicle to have a maximum return mileage of
54130. The entire foundations of your agreement would have been based on this given
mileage, including your balloon figure, and monthly rentals.
On reading your letter and familiarising myself with your agreement details whilst I
acknowledge the paragraph which details your termination rights, I must bring to your
attention the remainder of the financial document which clearly outlines that your mileage
will be pro-rated if the agreement ends early.
The part of the agreement you refer to does not specifically refer to excess mileage. It is
important therefore to assess the agreement as a whole; which having done so, we cannot
agree it to be reasonable for you to conclude that no excess mileage charge would
become payable on early termination.
The agreement specifically states: "If you end this agreement early the Maximum Total
Mileage will apply pro rata to the reduced period of hire and your obligation to pay the
Excess Mileage Charge will accrue accordingly immediately prior to termination; if the
Vehicle's mileage exceeds the Maximum Total Mileage calculated pro rata, you will
therefore have to pay the Excess Mileage Charge for each mile covered in excess of the
relevant Maximum Total Mileage".
Voluntary termination is not one of the return options offered to you by BMW Financial
Services. This is a right afforded to you by the consumer credit act as you hold a regulated
agreement. As your rights are detailed on the face of your agreement under the 'key
information' section, BMW Financial Services have made you aware of this right from the
outset of your finance with us, as such, it is not detailed as a 'return' option in any of our
further correspondence, but is available to you at any time, as per your documentation.
I can advise that Section 99 (2) allows us the provision to invoice you for anything accrued
prior to the termination of the agreement. Therefore, as your mileage was accrued before
you ended this agreement, we are able to invoice you for the excess under this provision.
BMW Financial Services send all the necessary information prior to termination to ensure
that you are fully aware of any further obligations, inclusive of mileage. On receipt of this
information if you had any questions or concerns we could have been contacted to discuss
this further. Now that the vehicle has been returned I regret that this opportunity has
passed and your contracted obligations for mileage have now become payable.
I understand that this may not have been the outcome that you were perhaps hoping for
however I hope you can understand our position.
Please note that, under the terms of our Complaints Procedure, this is our final response. If
you are dissatisfied with it, you have the right to refer your complaint to the
Financial Ombudsman Service, free of charge- but you must do so within six
months of the date of this letter.
If you do not refer your complaint in time, the Ombudsman will not have our permission to
consider your complaint and so will only be able to do so in very limited circumstances. For
example, if the Ombudsman believes that the delay was as a result of exceptional
circumstances.[/I]

If anybody can advise it would be appreciated thanks.

bigjl

Pay up would be my suggestion.

marlot

Why not take it to the FOS and get a ruling?

WellKnownSid

Is it me or does their reply make no sense at all? I always take a long drawn-out reply which cannot get to the point and makes several (but unconnected) points to justify the whole as a weak argument which hasn't been drawn up by a solicitor.

Paragraph 1: I don't agree with you
2: Everything in the world is based upon the mileage you said you were going to do
3: the bit about excess mileage is clearly stated in the agreement
4: except in fact it isn't so 'it is important to assess the agreement as a whole'
5: and I'm then going to instead refer to the bit of the agreement which does talk about excess mileage
6: Okay, so VT also isn't part of your agreement, so I'm just going to assume that the rules don't apply to your particular termination, blah blah blah
7, 8: Contact the FOS if you disagree.

motorguy

AdrianC wrote: »

You cancelled the policy at month 32 of 47 (68% of the time).
When you say your "agreed total mileage allowance" was 54k, do you mean that was over the entirety of the 47 month agreement - or is that pro-rata'd for the time, so 80k over the full duration? 13,500/yr or 20,000/yr?

If it was 80k for 47 months, then at 63k over 32 months, you're 16% (9,000 miles) over the pro-rata mileage allowance.
If it was 54k for 47 months, then at 63k over 32 months, you're 70% (26,300 miles) over the pro-rata mileage allowance.

Either is going to take you into excess mileage charges, which WILL be in the Ts & Cs of the lease, but the latter situation is going to be expensive.

Whether the service history was up to date and the condition was satisfactory makes no difference - you're not being asked to pay penalties over those, just the excess mileage.

No. No. No.

Firstly, this isnt a lease, as he is doing a VT

Secondly, a VT ceases the contract, therefore any terms in it are null and void.

There is no mileage stipulations around a VT, only around wear and tear.

motorguy

K_Fergy wrote: »

As a follow up to my previous posts regarding my termination with BMW, I recently received a final response letter from them basically outlining that I still owe them for the excess mileage and if I want to continue my complaint I must do so to the financial ombudsman service within 6 months of the date of this letter. Here is the text from the letter.

Thank you for your recent email regarding the Excess Mileage invoice raised on your
agreement. Having reviewed your agreement details, please allow me to explain our final
position why the invoice for excess mileage remains payable.
At the beginning of your agreement you gave us a predicted annual mileage of 8,000 miles
per annum. In turn we therefore expected the vehicle to have a maximum return mileage of
54130. The entire foundations of your agreement would have been based on this given
mileage, including your balloon figure, and monthly rentals.
On reading your letter and familiarising myself with your agreement details whilst I
acknowledge the paragraph which details your termination rights, I must bring to your
attention the remainder of the financial document which clearly outlines that your mileage
will be pro-rated if the agreement ends early.
The part of the agreement you refer to does not specifically refer to excess mileage. It is
important therefore to assess the agreement as a whole; which having done so, we cannot
agree it to be reasonable for you to conclude that no excess mileage charge would
become payable on early termination.
The agreement specifically states: "If you end this agreement early the Maximum Total
Mileage will apply pro rata to the reduced period of hire and your obligation to pay the
Excess Mileage Charge will accrue accordingly immediately prior to termination; if the
Vehicle's mileage exceeds the Maximum Total Mileage calculated pro rata, you will
therefore have to pay the Excess Mileage Charge for each mile covered in excess of the
relevant Maximum Total Mileage".
Voluntary termination is not one of the return options offered to you by BMW Financial
Services. This is a right afforded to you by the consumer credit act as you hold a regulated
agreement. As your rights are detailed on the face of your agreement under the 'key
information' section, BMW Financial Services have made you aware of this right from the
outset of your finance with us, as such, it is not detailed as a 'return' option in any of our
further correspondence, but is available to you at any time, as per your documentation.
I can advise that Section 99 (2) allows us the provision to invoice you for anything accrued
prior to the termination of the agreement. Therefore, as your mileage was accrued before
you ended this agreement, we are able to invoice you for the excess under this provision.
BMW Financial Services send all the necessary information prior to termination to ensure
that you are fully aware of any further obligations, inclusive of mileage. On receipt of this
information if you had any questions or concerns we could have been contacted to discuss
this further. Now that the vehicle has been returned I regret that this opportunity has
passed and your contracted obligations for mileage have now become payable.
I understand that this may not have been the outcome that you were perhaps hoping for
however I hope you can understand our position.
Please note that, under the terms of our Complaints Procedure, this is our final response. If
you are dissatisfied with it, you have the right to refer your complaint to the
Financial Ombudsman Service, free of charge- but you must do so within six
months of the date of this letter.
If you do not refer your complaint in time, the Ombudsman will not have our permission to
consider your complaint and so will only be able to do so in very limited circumstances. For
example, if the Ombudsman believes that the delay was as a result of exceptional
circumstances.[/I]

If anybody can advise it would be appreciated thanks.

Tell them to !!!! off frankly.

If you're doing a VT, their terms and conditions are null and void.

They're trying it on

motorguy

WellKnownSid wrote: »

Is it me or does their reply make no sense at all? I always take a long drawn-out reply which cannot get to the point and makes several (but unconnected) points to justify the whole as a weak argument which hasn't been drawn up by a solicitor.

Paragraph 1: I don't agree with you
2: Everything in the world is based upon the mileage you said you were going to do
3: the bit about excess mileage is clearly stated in the agreement
4: except in fact it isn't so 'it is important to assess the agreement as a whole'
5: and I'm then going to instead refer to the bit of the agreement which does talk about excess mileage
6: Okay, so VT also isn't part of your agreement, so I'm just going to assume that the rules don't apply to your particular termination, blah blah blah
7, 8: Contact the FOS if you disagree.

They're using smoke and mirrors.

They're saying a VT isnt an option they offer, therefore you must pay their excess mileage.

This is nonsense. A VT is a right afforded to you under the Consumer Credit Act.

motorguy

marlot wrote: »

Why not take it to the FOS and get a ruling?

Theres no "ruling" to be got. But i would certainly be reporting it to the FOS.

Wholly wrong what they are trying to do.

bigjl

motorguy wrote: »

No. No. No.

Firstly, this isnt a lease, as he is doing a VT

Secondly, a VT ceases the contract, therefore any terms in it are null and void.

There is no mileage stipulations around a VT, only around wear and tear.

I thought it was a mileage restricted PCP?

I always regarded them to be closer to a lease purchase scheme than HP.

I have never had a HP contract contain a mileage restriction.

The one i signed a couple of weeks ago didn't.

I did have a PCP back in 99, we did hand it back as it was surplus to requirements after about 2years, it wasn't a VT though, but I was not over on the miles

Surely if the price of the monthly rental is affected by mileage then you can't just put in a stupidly low figure, save a fortune then hand back the car when you feel like it with 3 times the agreed annual mileage being covered.