A Death By Eight Million Cuts

Generali

ruggedtoast wrote: »

This move isn't even particularly popular with many Conservative MPs. Mainly because they are worried its going to make them look even more underhanded than they already do.

The Tories are already bankrolled by, or actually are, some of the wealthiest people in the world. This is hardly the case for Labour, or indeed the vast majority of people who live in this unequal country.

It also beggars the question that why on earth are you in a Trade Union if you don't want to support the Labour Party? Without Labour there wouldn't be any unions, or in fact any workers rights at all.

While we are on the subject of political unfairness and Tory supporters how about the Tories do the decent thing and stop accepting donations from Media Moguls.

Every single major newspaper in the UK is now owned by Tory donors apart from the Guardian. Perhaps, in the week that the story broke that the British find their news to be the most right wing in Europe, it should be time to state that you can either be a propaganda arm for the government, or a government donor, but not both.

No wonder social media is scaring the bejesus out of them.

And Labour are funded by people who have never given permission for their money to fund the Labour Party!

ruggedtoast

Generali wrote: »

And Labour are funded by people who have never given permission for their money to fund the Labour Party!

Have you ever been a member of a Trade Union? It is fairly common knowledge among people who feel that they have to collectivise to avoid being completely exploited by the Tory government, their Tory voting bosses and the Tory establishment, that they are supporting the Labour movement and that involves their union patronising the Labour Party.

What the Tories are hoping is that considering many working people have never felt worse off. Even if they are lucky enough to work in an industry on an actual full time contract that even has a union they may opt not to donate because they dont feel they can afford it, hoping to get the protection without the investment.

The consequences of the Unions not supporting Labour financially may well lead to their end anyway, which the unions now have to try and explain to their members, as, unbelievably a dwindling number of working class people still actually believe the propaganda they are sold that the billionaires in the cabinet, none of whom know what it is like not to be able to pay a bill, care about working class people.

Generali

ruggedtoast wrote: »

Have you ever been a member of a Trade Union? It is fairly common knowledge among people who feel that they have to collectivise to avoid being completely exploited by the Tory government, their Tory voting bosses and the Tory establishment, that they are supporting the Labour movement and that involves their union patronising the Labour Party.

What the Tories are hoping is that considering many working people have never felt worse off. Even if they are lucky enough to work in an industry on an actual full time contract that even has a union they may opt not to donate because they dont feel they can afford it, hoping to get the protection without the investment.

The consequences of the Unions not supporting Labour financially may well lead to their end anyway, which the unions now have to try and explain to their members, as, unbelievably a dwindling number of working class people still actually believe the propaganda they are sold that the billionaires in the cabinet, none of whom know what it is like not to be able to pay a bill, care about working class people.

I am currently a member of a trade union and have been for about 5 years but I certainly don't vote Labor.

antrobus

ruggedtoast wrote: »

...It also beggars the question that why on earth are you in a Trade Union if you don't want to support the Labour Party? ....

Because of the services provided to you by said trade union?

Anyway, most trade unions are not affiliated to the Labour Party. Granted the 13 that are include some of the country's biggest unions, but not even all their members support Labour.

Here is a YouGov poll from 2013 showing that only 45% of them do, with 38% supporting another party, and 17% who don't know don't care.

https://yougov.co.uk/news/2013/09/09/labours-limited-appeal-trade-union-members/

ruggedtoast wrote: »

......While we are on the subject of political unfairness and Tory supporters how about the Tories do the decent thing and stop accepting donations from Media Moguls. ....

Which ones?

ruggedtoast wrote: »

......Every single major newspaper in the UK is now owned by Tory donors apart from the Guardian.

The Daily Mirror is owned by Tory donors? When did that happen? How much money have the Lebedevs, or the Barclay Bros, given to the Conservative Party? I know that DMGT makes no political donations, perhaps Rothermere does?

As far as I'm aware the only 'media mogul' that makes political donations is Richard Desmond and his money goes to UKIP.

ruggedtoast wrote: »

..Perhaps, in the week that the story broke that the British find their news to be the most right wing in Europe, it should be time to state that you can either be a propaganda arm for the government, or a government donor, but not both. ....

Since there don't appear to be any newspapers that are government donors, perhaps that question has already been settled.:)

ukcarper

Generali wrote: »

And Labour are funded by people who have never given permission for their money to fund the Labour Party!

They do by joining a afflialated Union and not choosing to opt out of political levy.

CLAPTON

ruggedtoast wrote: »

T

It also beggars the question that why on earth are you in a Trade Union if you don't want to support the Labour Party? Without Labour there wouldn't be any unions, or in fact any workers rights at all.

Indeed so
which is why so few people are members of TUs or of the Labour party

Generali

ukcarper wrote: »

They do by joining a afflialated Union and not choosing to opt out of political levy.

Or under the proposed new rules members could join a union and decide to opt in to supporting Labour.

I don't support Labor but my union supports them and uses my money to do so.

ukcarper

Generali wrote: »

Or under the proposed new rules members could join a union and decide to opt in to supporting Labour.

I don't support Labor but my union supports them and uses my money to do so.

Can't you opt out of political levy then, I know people in the union I belonged to who did.

Generali

ukcarper wrote: »

Can't you opt out of political levy then, I know people in the union I belonged to who did.

There is no way that I can see. That might just be because I am:

1. Too dumb to opt out (possible)
2. Too lazy to opt out (probable)
3. Not able to do so as it's made not possible or deliberately made difficult (pretty likely)


We also have an investigation going on over here into unions. One finding is that unions have been approaching companies and agreeing that new employees will become union members. In return, companies will pay subs for members to the union. As a result unions can afford to pay officers of the union a lot more and provide officers with credit cards which have been used to spend hundreds of thousands of dollars.

The Labor Government tried to prevent prosecutions (can't think why) but under the Liberal Government some of the skeletons are coming out.

ukcarper

Generali wrote: »

There is no way that I can see. That might just be because I am:

1. Too dumb to opt out (possible)
2. Too lazy to opt out (probable)
3. Not able to do so as it's made not possible or deliberately made difficult (pretty likely)


We also have an investigation going on over here into unions. One finding is that unions have been approaching companies and agreeing that new employees will become union members. In return, companies will pay subs for members to the union. As a result unions can afford to pay officers of the union a lot more and provide officers with credit cards which have been used to spend hundreds of thousands of dollars.

The Labor Government tried to prevent prosecutions (can't think why) but under the Liberal Government some of the skeletons are coming out.

I believe you should be able to opt out of political Levy but I also think the only reason the Tories are proposing the change is to reduce labours funding.