Power of Attorney

tommytynan123

Probably not the correct forum (or site) for this but I'm really struggling so any advice would be most welcome. Mum, 84, is now in a nursing home. She was deemed to be of sound mind few weeks back to make a decision regarding treatment but is now getting more and more confused every day. She has her bungalow (owned outright) that she will probably never go back to which naturally has its associated financial comittments. We don't know how long she has but we feel it easier if my sister or I (or both?) gain some form of power of attorney over her affairs. Is that the correct approach and even though she is confused we don't know how to have this difficult conversation. Any help would be really appreciated. Thanks

Yorkshireman99

Being confused does not mean that she lacks capacity to give POA. However you need to have professional advice from her doctors as to her capacity. They should be able to help as well on how to approach her on the subject. If she does not have capacity the only option is to apply to the Court of Protection.

On a more general point giving POA is just as important as making a will. Sorry I can't help more.

getmore4less

Google Lasting Power of Attorney(LPA) regular POA is no good.

Keep_pedalling

You should act without delay on this. The crucial thing is that you will only be able to get an LPA in place if your mother has the capacity to understand what it is and what it authorises her attorneys to do.

First thing Monday contact her GP, under the circumstances they would be the best person to act as the certificate provider (the person who signs section 10 of the LPA) and if they will not do this because they do not believe your mother has the capacity to act then you will have to go down the more complex and much more expensive route of the CoP.

Assuming that you can still proceed with an LPA, you should be aware that it will take between 6&8 weeks to get it registered with the office of the public guardian, and any minor error can result in the application being rejected, so I would strongly recommend before getting any of the sections signed you get a solicitor to check the wording.

Edit - once you have this sorted, make sure you sort out LPAs for yourselves, and wills too, if like far too many people you have not already done so.

tiger305

Thank you all. Given this some thought overnight and in reality all we (sister and/or me) may need at the moment is the ability to cancel / amend DD's etc and, if required, access to her accounts to pay any outstanding or future bills. It would be nice if we could mop up all the financial outgoings (now or future) and then recoup via the will but we can't as we are just average people doing average jobs with normal bills etc. Mum has said before that the will is written and makes me the executor. Its either at home or with the solicitor that my late father used - can check with them.
To achieve that all we need, I think, is a letter from Mum to her bank giving me / sister authority to handle the money.
Any comments appreciated. Seeing her tomorrow morning. Unfortunately I live 2 hours away and I'm going up every 2/3 days so we need to get things done while I'm there. Thanks

FreeBear

tiger305 wrote: »

To achieve that all we need, I think, is a letter from Mum to her bank giving me / sister authority to handle the money.

A third party mandate for each will allow you access to your mum's money and allow you to pay bills. But if you need to make major financial decisions such as selling a property then you will need the LPA.

If you need to change or cancel contracts (phone, power, etc) or need to discuss finances with other companies, they may well want sight of an LPA before doing so.

Bear in mind there are two types of LPA - One allows you to conduct financial affairs, the other gives you the powers to make health & welfare decisions. The latter will become increasingly important as/when her health deteriorates.

nom_de_plume

One thing to be aware of is you mention the bungalow and a will. If your mum has specifically left the bungalow to someone(s) in her will and the bungalow gets sold to help pay for care etc. it would no longer exist for the purposes of her estate and any intended beneficiary could lose out. It could be prudent to review her will at the same time as sorting out POA.

securityguy

"Given this some thought overnight and in reality all we (sister and/or me) may need at the moment is the ability to cancel / amend DD's etc and, if required, access to her accounts to pay any outstanding or future bills."

You need a lasting power of attorney. Here's why.

1. If the bank finds out, or suspects, that someone who is either one party of a joint account or the sole party of an account with signing rights for a third party, they are not only entitled but obligated to freeze the account. This applies for spouses, never mind parents and children. Yes, you'll hear anecdotes of how people didn't have a problem, but that's not the point: you might be the unlucky ones.

2. You cannot do anything with your mother's house, which might include selling it but might also involve renting it out (if only so it doesn't stand empty which will, apart from anything else, invalidate the insurance) without an LPOA. If she's not living in the bungalow it will become subject to significantly higher council tax and insurance, and anyway the local authority are probably going to ask why it can't be sold to pay for care. You're going to need to either sell it or rent it out.

3. You cannot do anything with your mother's other financial commitments, such as cashing in savings, without a power of attorney. You don't say how the care is being funded, bit if it's the council they'll want to assess her assets, and if it's not, you're going to need to work to maintain that current stream of income.

My grandmother went into care without a power of attorney, leaving my parents with a massive hassle with a court of protection deputyship. They could probably, with hindsight, have just about managed to get a (in those days enduring, what is today lasting) power of attorney had they done so quickly; my grandmother's GP said that she would have been OK about it in the first few months. After that, it's the court of protection, and that's expensive and time-consuming. If you don't get a POA now, you won't be able to later, and you will regret it.

securityguy

nom_de_plume wrote: »

One thing to be aware of is you mention the bungalow and a will. If your mum has specifically left the bungalow to someone(s) in her will and the bungalow gets sold to help pay for care etc. it would no longer exist for the purposes of her estate and any intended beneficiary could lose out. It could be prudent to review her will at the same time as sorting out POA.

Yes, a will which says "my house to X, my other assets to Y" is problematic if the house is sold. However, a will written by someone who is "getting more and more confused every day" is eminently challengeable: if everyone in the family gets along well then they might be better off using a deed of variation to sort things out afterwards, and if there are tensions in the family over money then a redrafted will altering the beneficiaries right at the last moment before she loses capacity is the stuff of court cases.

Oh, and messing around with tenure of the house now would scream "deprivation of assets" and, if done by an attorney who was also a beneficiary and stood to gain from the transaction, misuse of a POA.

getmore4less

A standard POA only active/valid while the giver has capacity.

Keep_pedalling

getmore4less wrote: »

A standard POA only active/valid while the giver has capacity.

A Standard POA may be OK as a stop gap, but if your mum is capable start the ball rolling on a LPA without delay, it really will make life so much easier in the coming months and years.

I manage all my mothers financial matters through a LPA, and although hopefully we won't need them for many years both my wife and myself have them in place and registered just in case one or both of us are incapacitated in some way.