Problems With DFC Finance

unholyangel

tomtontom wrote: »

They have given you a chance to provide evidence of your cancellation - you are not able to do so. That's not a delaying tactic, that was them trying to resolve the matter.

There is no point in you trying to contact the gym, they no longer have an interest in this.

From an outsider's point of view, you're not helping yourself. The fact is that you didn't cancel, you are liable for the outstanding fee (£40) plus reasonable costs for their work. The more you argue the point, the more the costs will rise.

Please get someone to help you with this, if you continue you're going to end up with a CCJ against you and more costs.

Its only the last email OP said they didn't have proof of, they have the first two (according to their OP....they said they were cancelling in all 3 emails).

Afterwards, I decided that I had changed my mind about my induction and wanted to cancel. I tried to call them the following afternoon to cancel but they did not answer, so I sent an email instead saying I was cancelling and would try calling them again when I wanted to re-book.

I received no response back from the gym, so I resent the email and once again tried to call but there was no answer.

After a couple of days, I decided I was no longer interested in joining the gym. I sent them a final email to cancel but had no response back. I then took the decision to cancel my direct debit, this was done well within the 14 day "cool off" period as outlined.

OP can you clarify exactly what you said in the first two emails?

Hoob87

unholyangel wrote: »

OP I admit I skimmed through your posts so excuse me if I cover anything you've already given the answer to.

1) Ask them why you didn't receive confirmation of the contract by durable means - as required by the consumer contract regulations (since you signed up online).
2) Also when they keep adding on charges when you have cancelled within the cancellation period.

From CCR's


But this is nothing new - the DSRs were the same (with regards to being taken to have been send on the day it was posted or (if sent by email) sent electronically.

That's okay, thanks for your help and previous reply.

The only thing I received was a confirmation of Direct Debit from DFC. I did not receive any kind of "welcome email" or confirmation of membership from the gym themsevles, I didn't know if I was allowed to go the same day and start using it or wether I needed to wait until I had paid, that's why I had to google the contact details for the gym and ask them myself. I had absolutley no clue who DFC were at that time, but just had to assume that they were involved with the gym somehow. I don't recall agreeing to any late payment charges when I signed up, this was only communicated AFTER singing up, getting charged and then seeing it in the small print, again, AFTER signing up.

Ok yes fair enough, my "proper" cancellation request was not received by the gym. There must have been some kind of bug with my web browser because I'm convinved I hit that send button.

The only reason I took the descision to email was because they failed to answer the phone when I called, I deal with emails on a daily basis, and in business terms, an email is classed as and just as important as a letter. I thought, it's direct, clear and will be received by them instantly.

I have had experience in the past of companies failing to remove Direct Debits, so I cancelled mine with my bank for peace at mind.

I have admitted there was a mistake, I have also explained that I cancelled my induction and then intended to cancel my membership litterally 2 days later. They are able to see with this in mind that infact yes, I was intending to cancel and wasn't trying to pull a fast one. I'd understand if I had done the induction, spent a few days at the gym and then cancelled my DD without telling them intentionally would be a different story, however this is not the case.

I have received no letter with their full terms and conditions or anything to pysically sign and agree to.

So they have been informed I intended to cancel within the first couple of days. I have also told them the services have not been used and I wanted them cancelled straight away, numerous times.

As I mentioned in a reply above, I feel I have made a notable effort to resolve the case and satisfy their requests, they appear to have done diddly squat. As far as I am concered, they are preventing a resolution, not me.

Please can you explain further what you mean by "receive confirmation of the contract by durable means - as required by the consumer contract regulations (since you signed up online".

I am not familiar with this lol.

Many thanks again.

T

unholyangel

CCRs mandate that where a contract is concluded by distance means, certain information has to be provided to the consumer.

The information required to be provided are covered under the following sections:
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2013/3134/regulation/13/made
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2013/3134/regulation/14/made
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2013/3134/regulation/16/made
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2013/3134/schedule/2/made

ETA: its also for the retailer to prove they complied with those provisions - not for you to prove they didn't.

Hoob87

tomtontom wrote: »

They have given you a chance to provide evidence of your cancellation - you are not able to do so. That's not a delaying tactic, that was them trying to resolve the matter.

There is no point in you trying to contact the gym, they no longer have an interest in this.

From an outsider's point of view, you're not helping yourself. The fact is that you didn't cancel, you are liable for the outstanding fee (£40) plus reasonable costs for their work. The more you argue the point, the more the costs will rise.

Please get someone to help you with this, if you continue you're going to end up with a CCJ against you and more costs.

No, they asked me to provide evidence. When I had spotted the error, I then told them at least 3 times I was not able to.

It was then AFTER this they asked me to show them the emails which had been sent, I again clearly outlined that these did NOT include the cancellation email they asked for. I sent them clear and high resolution screen shots of the emails. Several days later they then came back to me and asked for them to be forwarded instead. So I did, it was then another several days later they came back and disregarded them.

I'm sorry but to me, this strongly comes across as them creating a delay, and funnily enough, by the time they had come back to me, another late fee was applied.

And "their work", I'm sorry but sending me replies that are litterally several lines long, lacking in information, in so many words basically saying "We don't care, pay it" does not gel with me as being "work".

I have made twice more of an effort to resolve this than they have! You think I honestly have time to fart about with emails to and from a company that are being petty over £15?

Like I said, I have made them an offer and they declined. If these charges are for their "work", it's them who are creating it not me. I offered to resolve this weeks ago, they didn't accept. I couldn't afford to pay £65, so do they honestly think I'm going to able to now pay £130?

Infact, if they had stop adding chrages like I had asked them to, because it's been so long, I probably could have paid the £65.

Cheers

T

matttye

unholyangel wrote: »

And they'd be hard pushed to explain to a court why they ignored clear instructions by durable medium.

Just because it says something in the T&C's (especially when those T&C's belong to a gym) does not mean its legally enforceable.

Well it depends where the OP sent his emails to doesn't it.

If you send an email to the wrong department should that department be expected to do anything other than tell you to email the correct department?

The OP admits to finding the contact details on Google - they could be out of date. The fact that no replies have been received could indicate that they are not the correct contact details (amongst other things of course).

Clearly if you follow the cancellation method specified in the terms and conditions they will have absolutely no leg to stand on, otherwise they might be able to argue non receipt.

unholyangel

matttye wrote: »

Well it depends where the OP sent his emails to doesn't it.

If you send an email to the wrong department should that department be expected to do anything other than tell you to email the correct department?

The OP admits to finding the contact details on Google - they could be out of date. The fact that no replies have been received could indicate that they are not the correct contact details (amongst other things of course).

Clearly if you follow the cancellation method specified in the terms and conditions they will have absolutely no leg to stand on, otherwise they might be able to argue non receipt.

If its sent to the last business email address known to the consumer, then its treated as having been sent correctly - irrespective of whether its received or not.

As I said above, its nothing new. It was the same under the DSRs.

With a letter or email you can prove that you cancelled. With a phone call, you can only prove that you called them - not what was discussed. It actually used to be a stipulation that cancellation had to be done by durable medium to comply with DSRs. From memory, I don't believe that provision was carried over to CCRs however, if the company were to accept cancellation on their website, they need to send the consumer a receipt of cancellation in a durable medium.

Hoob87

unholyangel wrote: »

Its only the last email OP said they didn't have proof of, they have the first two (according to their OP....they said they were cancelling in all 3 emails).



OP can you clarify exactly what you said in the first two emails?

My first email to the gym was to ask when I was able to start using the it as their website had no information about when I was able to do so, and the fact I had not received any kind of information pack from them.

The gym then responded and said "You must book in for a gym induction PRIOR to being able to use it"

I then booked in for an induction for 7pm the following day.

I then wanted to cancel the induction and said that I would be in touch the following day to re-book one.

I never re-booked an induction but instead told them that, upon reflection, due to a previous sports injury that was playing up, I wanted to cancel and that I would certainly be wanting to sign up again in probably a few months time.

It was this email that did not reach them.

I never got a response or acknowledgement from the gym regarding the cancellation of my induction. I was also expecting a response from them regrading the membership cancellation. I assumed they had received them, probably got a bit miffed that I had pulled out and just cancelled it for me, and as mentioned above, I wanted to cancel my DD just incase they had "forgotten" to do this, as past experience has shown me not all companies are proactive at doing this themselves. *cough estateagents coughcough* Some companies may even charge you for having the money returned.

I just feel like they are throwing their toys out of the pram, being a little awkward and making an example out of me, even though I have explained the very best I can, it was a honest and genuine mistake, I will pay the £40 but cannot afford £65 (now £130)

They refused and still continue to add chrages, they have not even offered any compramises, reductions, payment plans, asked if I was in finacial difficulty, just straight up bare bones WE WANT THE MONEY.

Thanks

T

Hoob87

matttye wrote: »

Well it depends where the OP sent his emails to doesn't it.

If you send an email to the wrong department should that department be expected to do anything other than tell you to email the correct department?

The OP admits to finding the contact details on Google - they could be out of date. The fact that no replies have been received could indicate that they are not the correct contact details (amongst other things of course).

Clearly if you follow the cancellation method specified in the terms and conditions they will have absolutely no leg to stand on, otherwise they might be able to argue non receipt.

As above, it states communication must be made to the gym themselves. The contact details I used were correct and in use because thet replied to me regarding needing an induction PRIOR to being able to use the gym.

Thanks

T

Hoob87

unholyangel wrote: »

If its sent to the last business email address known to the consumer, then its treated as having been sent correctly - irrespective of whether its received or not.

As I said above, its nothing new. It was the same under the DSRs.

With a letter or email you can prove that you cancelled. With a phone call, you can only prove that you called them - not what was discussed. It actually used to be a stipulation that cancellation had to be done by durable medium to comply with DSRs. From memory, I don't believe that provision was carried over to CCRs however, if the company were to accept cancellation on their website, they need to send the consumer a receipt of cancellation in a durable medium.

Even though the intial cancellation email did not send, I have made an effort to prove (without actually having it) that I intended to send it and was under the impression I did send it.

I can't prove I did, and at the same time they can't prove that I didn't.

In my opinion, they should have stopped all late payment fee's the minute I got in touch with DFC and explained the situation. I requested cancellation there and then. I fully understand the first £15 fee, as they did not know it had intended to be cancelled. I kindly asked if the £15 was taken off, I could probably make a payment that day to settle the account.

They didn't want to know.

As far as they are concerned, it was cancelled the day I told DFC directly it was cancelled, forget about the gym, I understand now that is probably irrelevant, but it's the fact I have asked them cancel, they have not acknowledges my request to cancel and are still charging me fee's.

Thanks

T

unholyangel

Were you provided with the information I linked to above? Specifically:
(j)the arrangements for payment, delivery, performance, and the time by which the trader undertakes to deliver the goods or to perform the services;
(l)where a right to cancel exists, the conditions, time limit and procedures for exercising that right in accordance with regulations 27 to 38;