Share of service charge

Irratus_Rusticus

Hi. As already said since (I think!), you might be counting two separate freeholds and one has nothing to do with you even if owned by the same freeholder.

That is definitely worth checking further in case being charged for communal services/works for a freehold you have no responsibility for - it happens.

The two flats only showing freehold tenure are presumably retained by the freeholder(s) so why not pay £6 total and get both those titles to see who's who. I'd want to know. You can also ask the agent for the background records to service charges and, armed with the knowledge there are two freeholds and not a shared freehold, make sure you know what expenses and for waht you are paying for.

It works both ways. The lease is king and you must pay what you owe, but it is king over the freeholder too and you have no obligation to pay for more than YOUR development as described on your lease. The lease must describe that or it is a nonsense to calculate a share - a share of what?.

You need to delve further. Which isn't much help!

cowsnhope

:-) Thank you Winter Phoenix. I agree that it is likely that the building was originally 30 then divided in half to be 30 and 30a; 30 being upstairs and 30A being the ground floor and basement which used to be a shop. This shop was only converted and divided about two years ago to create 30a and flat 2 30a (I'm not sure what has gone on upstairs).

I still do not understand why this leaves the ground floor front flat (30a) as a freehold as it is showing up on the Land registry and whether or not they are paying into the same service charge as me. My worry is that the whole building might not be one freehold with each flat paying towards the same service charge.

I did not think a freehold flat was a good thing; when I was looking for a property to buy a financial adviser thought a flat I was interested in was a freehold flat and told me no mortgage company would lend on this as there was no clear responsibility for repairs to the building. Could I have unwittingly brought a flat in a house that contains freehold flats and if so shouldn't my solicitor have spotted this?
Many thanks

cowsnhope

Ah - ok so the freeholder might own the flats that do not have a lease; that is a less worrying thought I think.

G_M

cowsnhope wrote: »

30 Leasehold and Freehold
30A Freehold
30 Flat 1 Freehold
30A Flat 2 Freehold / Leasehold (this is my flat)
30 Flat 2 Freehold / Leasehold

All five flats have the note that you can hover over that says the title is duplicated elsewhere.

I'm afraid I'm still confused, The flats upstairs are numbered 1, 2a and 3. The flat out the front is just 30A and mine is 30A Flat 2. So I do not know where flat 3 is ... maybe just 30?? Also I do not know why 30A and 30 Flat 1 just say Freehold. Is it possible to have a building where some flats are freehold and others leasehold and if so what happens when the roof needs fixing?

Thank you - I'm beginning to be a little concerned about this

If you want to know which flat is which, buy the Title for each flat, + the Plan for each flat (£3 each) and read.

Irratus_Rusticus

Further thought... unless I've lost the plot there can't be one freehold for the upstairs of the same building and a different one for the ground floor conversion - not unless the upstairs is a floating freehold from an adjacent building.

A single freehold property house can be divided and sold as multiple freeholds and registered as such if each freehold sits on solid old English soil - that's why leasehold had to be conjured up.

So I would buy copies of the two titles and my guess is they will be the same title - nut maybe shared or maybe owned by one freeholder.

Establish that at least as you have one unhelpful lease to be sure!

cowsnhope

Thank you all. You are right I need to spend £24 to find the definite answer to this but as that is a lot of money to me I'm going to wait and see what the managing agent says first as so far he's been really helpful - if that gets me nowhere I'll have to fork out the money.

cowsnhope

Hi. I started this thread some time ago and have found that my managing agent does not want to answer my questions. I have repeatedly asked what proportion the other flats pay each and he just says they all contribute but there doesn't seem to be anything in writing to say what the freeholder, as owner of half the flats, pays.

What I have found out is that the whole building has one freeholder who also owns three out of the six flats; the other three have leaseholds. I have also discovered that the attic has been converted and that whilst I pay one third of all charges I own only one sixth of the building. To me this does not seem right as I am paying for something but not getting the benefit - I'm paying for someone else's share of communal cleaning, lighting and maintaince and am worried that if there is a big expense that I'll be paying more of it than any other flat - about twice as much as some of the flats which are bigger than mine.

I contacted a solicitor who specialises in leaseholds earlier (primarily because their website seemed to say lenses had to be fair and based on the size of the flats) however they charged £100 plus VAT and could not say over the phone if I had any sort of case. I do not have much money.

Does anyone think I can do anything here?
Many thanks

G_M

cowsnhope wrote: »

Hi. I started this thread some time ago and have found that my managing agent does not want to answer my questions.
I'm not surprised as your questions probobly relate to matters that are nothing to do with your leasehold (see below)

I have repeatedly asked what proportion the other flats pay each and he just says they all contribute
Indeed. The contractual arrangements between the freeholder and other leaseholders are private matters between them. They do not concern you.

but there doesn't seem to be anything in writing to say what the freeholder, as owner of half the flats, pays.
He does not pay in his capacity as freeholder. he pays in his capacity as owner of 3 leases. The terms of those leases are a private matter between him and the freeholder (himself in this instance).

What I have found out is that the whole building has one freeholder who also owns three out of the six flats; the other three have leaseholds. I have also discovered that the attic has been converted and that whilst I pay one third of all charges I own only one sixth of the building. To me this does not seem right as I am paying for something but not getting the benefit - I'm paying for someone else's share of communal cleaning, lighting and maintaince and am worried that if there is a big expense that I'll be paying more of it than any other flat - about twice as much as some of the flats which are bigger than mine.
As previously explained, what you pay is determined by your lease.

When you purchased the lease, you had the opportunity to read it before purchase. You accepted the terms, and agreed to pay whateve the lease specified when you Completed the purchase.

How the terms were first drawn up is neither here not there. The time to question this was befroe agreeing to purchase the lease as written.

I contacted a solicitor who specialises in leaseholds earlier (primarily because their website seemed to say lenses had to be fair and based on the size of the flats) however they charged £100 plus VAT and could not say over the phone if I had any sort of case. I do not have much money.

Does anyone think I can do anything here?
Many thanks

You could sell your lease and move to another leasehold property with terms that your find more acceptable, or buy a freehold property.

Or stay where you are and pay what the lease you own says you owe.

cowsnhope

Hi. Thank you.
The freeholder is not the owner of three leases - the three flats he owns do not appear to have leases it is the other three flats including mine.

I have had a leasehold before and the statement always said what percentage of the total costs were due by each flat and whether or not they'd paid - I therefore thought it was a reasonable question

teneighty

Possibly if you download the freehold title from the land registry website it will show the deed plan that will confirm if the building has one freehold title or whether as others have suggested it is in fact 2 adjoining buildings.

It rather sounds like the agents are charging you for both buildings but with the apportionment from 1.