Mobile Phone

markfj

Hi Guys, a quick question please

I purchased a phone from an online retailer on contract.

I had a few issues with it freezing, lagging and sometimes not responding until I removed battery and reinserted.

I contacted the people I ordered if through just within 30 day period, and I explained this to them and I fully admitted, the phone had a mark where it had dropped, but this was after all the freezing issues etc, so they aren't related.

They said as the phone is now not in "pristine condition" they wouldn't do anything about it, even though I'm only wanting a repair for the intial faults done. They say I need to go through the phone manufacturer, but they will charge me as its now marked and out of their warranty too.

Is this right, under the consumer act of oct 2015? I don't mind paying for the damage I caused, which is minor and cosmetic, but I don't see why I am paying for a fault that wasn't mine to begin with

Thanks

marliepanda

They can do their own investigation into the fault.

You only told them about the fault after your dropped it. How do they know you dropping it hasn't caused the fault? They only have your word for that and you didn't tell them of the fault when it began.

markfj

Yes that's true, and I fully admit, and admitted to them that's true.

Ive had the phone just over a month, and it happens freezes once a week or so, I figured a hard reset would sort it, but it didn't, I removed some apps I thought might cause it but made no difference

So, I'm not denying its been dropped and that perhaps I should have contacted them straight away, though phones often freeze every now and then, my issue now is that they didn't offer to do anything at all to help, not even look at it, quote for repair, anything.

Cheers

marliepanda

Why is the phone out of the manufacturers warranty? Is the phone new?

Where the the damage to the phone? I know a lot of companies won't do repair work under guarantee when the screen has damage.

markfj

marliepanda wrote: »

Why is the phone out of the manufacturers warranty? Is the phone new?

Yes the phone is new, but the warranty doesn't cover it once it has physical damage, looking around, Samsung are quite strict on this too.

Ive been told 2 different things by Samsung, one of which was they can inspect and repair the damage caused by dropping, then its under warranty for them to look at the initial faults

The 2nd, its not under warranty as its marked and therefore id need to pay for any repairs, they said contact retailer. which i'd already done

markfj

bottom right hand side, it fell out of my pocket had heapdones attached at the time, so it judt hit the floor on that corner

JJ_Egan

Samsung will quote a price if you send it to them .Almost certain that they will void warranty as they do in similar cases .Its a limited warranty with strict terms and conditions .
You have a lot more rights under CRA/Soga .

Return it to the vendor and let them prove your damage is not the problem .

markfj

Thanks, I will have a read up

I'm abit stuck at the moment, as I'm going away for 4 weeks, so I cant send it back as I wont get it back before I go away.

Am I right in thinking, it wont make a difference if I do this after my holiday (around 6 weeks from now) as I let the company know within 30 days?

I wouldn't mind, but they first said they wouldn't take it in as its older than 30 days, I said no that's incorrect, so they said as its makred they still wouldn't take it in regardless

Either way they weren't going to take it in, it seemed

cheers

marliepanda

I personally wouldnt continue to use the phone for another 6 weeks after telling them you want them to fix it. It just gives them more ammunition to blame you and weakens your position, especially as the damage is already giving them something on which to refuse your claim.

markfj

Yeah I thought that too to be honest

I can try to contact the Retailer again, but they wont give a returns address until someone has agreed to take it back in with a number, after speaking to them last time, this wont happen.

I did send them another email, last night, which hopefully ill get a reply to in the working week. And yes the damage is typical, ive had my last phone several years with no damage, have this one a few weeks an manage to mark it even with a case, typical.

cheers again

markfj

So, I contacted a couple of phone shops and also Citizens Advice.

Both phone shops state that they believe it to be a Software issue and not a hardware issue, so I'm trying to find if they believe its possible it come with faulty software to begin with so I have that in writing.

My reply from Citizens Advice, was helpful and in good detail. My only query really, is they say in the letter to write to them, to tell them what action you will take, if they do not comply. But I'm not sure what action I can really take, other than small claims court for example.

Here is the reply they sent to me, it sounds like I have a decent case, I think

We understand from your email that you are trying to establish your legal position after experiencing problems with a mobile phone you purchased where after a few days of owning it the phone began to freeze and wouldn’t respond. You have spoke to the trader and it appears that they are not willing to offer a remedy due to the phone being dropped although the issues were there before the phone was dropped.




Before offering any advice I would like to clarify that the Citizens Advice consumer service is only one of the services offered by the charity, Citizens Advice. Our role is to provide first stage consumer advice, and to also collect data for most of the Trading Standards authorities throughout the UK. This is because, different Trading Standards authorities offer different range of services, meaning not all offer civil assistance and instead concentrate on enforcement and/or weights and measure issues.




Therefore, because most people contacting Trading Standards are looking for civil advice; Trading Standards direct the majority of contacts to the Citizens Advice consumer service so we can provide advice and collect data.




Your rights and obligations:




On 01/10/2015 significant changes were made to consumer law in the United Kingdom (UK) under a piece of legislation called the Consumer Rights Act 2015. As such your contact with the trader would be governed by the Consumer Rights Act 2015. This is because this piece of legislation governs all contracts formed in the UK on or after 01/10/2015, when a consumer enters into an agreement for the supply of goods, services, and digital downloads from a trader; such as a retailer, garage, tradesman, finance company etc. Subsequently it is this piece of legislation that will provide you with your statutory rights; meaning, any guarantee, warranty or company policy could only offer you additional rights, without affecting or restricting your rights under this piece of law. You can read more about the Consumer Rights Act here.




Amongst other things the Consumer Rights Act 2015 states that all goods (tangible and moveable item) supplied by a trader to a consumer must be of a satisfactory quality, fit for the purpose made known and comply with any description, sample or model.



Satisfactory quality means that the goods should be free from faults, last a reasonable time and be fit for the purpose they were made for.



Therefore if you can demonstrate that the phone does not meet these requirements; you may hold the trader in breach of contract and ask them to provide a suitable form of redress.



When a consumer has experienced problems with goods they have purchased from a trader, the Consumer Rights Act 2015 provides the consumer with first and second tier remedies. A first tier remedy can be requested by the consumer when they make the trader aware of any issues they have experienced with the goods within the first 30 days of the taking possession of them. This remedy is known as ‘the short term right to reject’ which means the consumer can expect the trader to take the goods back for a full refund.



Please note, when a consumer tries to exercise their right to reject goods for a refund, the law places the ‘burden of proof’ on the consumer. To clarify, the onus would be on the consumer to demonstrate that the goods in question do not comply with the Consumer Rights Act 2015; subsequently the trader could ask the consumer to provide reasonable evidence that the fault(s) are not due to fair, wear and tear, misuse or neglect.



Therefore if a consumer would prefer, they could seek one repair or replacement. To expand further when a consumer seeks a repair or replacement the ‘burden of proof’ would be on the trader. This means the onus would be upon the trader to demonstrate that the fault is due to fair wear and tear, misuse or neglect; if they do not feel they are liable for the problems the consumer has experienced with the goods in question.



In addition, when goods develop a fault within the first 30 days of purchase, and the consumer requests a repair or replacement a ‘waiting period’ would begin. This means that the 30 day period is paused whilst the trader carries out a repair or arranges a replacement. When the consumer receives the goods back, or a suitable replacement, they would then have the rest of the 30 day period; or a minimum of 7 days (whichever is the longest period) to check that the goods conform to the contract. Subsequently should the same or different fault develop within this time, the consumer could then look to reject the goods for a full refund.



Please be aware that when a fault develops after the first 30 days, a consumer can still seek a repair, or replacement and the burden of proof would remain with the trader for the first six months. In addition if a refund is offered because a repair is not economically viable or a suitable replacement cannot be sourced; the consumer can expect a full refund on the provision the trader was made aware of the faults within the first six months.




Your next steps:




If you wish to pursue a civil claim, you should consider sending the trader a recorded delivery letter, outlining everything to date, and giving a deadline to resolve the matter within a set period of time (e.g. 14 days). Make it very clear what you expect from the trader; why and what steps you will consider taking should they fail to comply with your request. It is also worth enclosing copies of any documentation that would help you substantiate your claim and retaining copies of everything sent, for your records.




A suitable template can be found here.




When using the template letters it is important that you follow the online instructions carefully. In addition, once the letter has been generated it may also require further editing, in order to make it clear to the trader what the nature of your complaint is.




Sending letters by recorded delivery will allow you to track the letter using the ‘Recorded Signed For’ label the post office supply you with; to make sure the intended recipient receives the letter. As such, they would be unable to claim that you have never attempted to make them aware of your intentions should they fail to comply with your request; refuse to accept delivery; or fail to offer a response.




What we’ll do:




We will inform Trading Standards of the trader's activities in this situation for further consideration regarding any enforcement issues. Whilst this is unlikely to help with your own civil complaint, Trading Standards can take into consideration such complaints when prioritizing their activities.




If you require any further advice or information about this case, please do not hesitate to contact the Citizens Advice consumer service by return email or on 03454 04 05 06 quoting the case reference number.




Thank you for your email.