the estate agent can't provide a vendor questionnaire

kenzie123

Hi

We are first time buyers - we've had an offer accepted on a flat.

A few things have given us a gut feeling that something is wrong but we want to check this isn't just nerves / FTB inexperience.

- the flat is around £20k cheaper than other similar ones in the area
- the vendor would not take offers - just accepted our offer as long as we offered the asking price
- there is some clear unfinished work in the flat (it's a new build in an older refurbished building) e.g the extractor fan is missing. so we've asked for this to be repaired before we commit, and no one is getting back to us either way.
- we're being asked to put down a £100 deposit. it will go against searches on the property but will allow us to get confirmation the flat is ours.
- the estate agent cannot provide a completed vendor questionnaire
- the estate agent says that the vendor insists that we use their recommended solicitor, its actually part of the terms of sale i.e if we don't use the estate agent's solicitor, we can't buy the property
- the solicitor quote t&c's state some extra costs. we've asked for approximate figures for the transfer engrossment fee, fees for the managing agents of the freeholder, and new homes developer fees - none of which can be clarified. They just said they don't know this yet.
- overall the estate agents - who are a large, reputable firm - are being quite monosyllabic with answers on email and generally not helping us move forward. We do have an appointment with the in house mortgage advisor who is quite pushy (not unexpected) and it feels everyone works for the same company - therefore we are unsure that we're being truly and fairly represented here.

Overall - signs say we should just walk away, but we have been looking for a long time (about a year without success), we're in London, and are desperate to get on the ladder.

Are any of the above viable warning signs or is this just the norm for buyers?

Would love to hear your opinions

thank you

G_M

kenzie123 wrote: »

Hi

- the flat is around £20k cheaper than other similar ones in the area
* because it is 'unfinished'
* the reason it is unfinished is the developr has cashflow problems
- the vendor would not take offers - just accepted our offer as long as we offered the asking price
* vendor in a hurry to sell - cashflow!
- there is some clear unfinished work in the flat (it's a new build in an older refurbished building) e.g the extractor fan is missing. so we've asked for this to be repaired before we commit, and no one is getting back to us either way.
* forget this. Either buy this cheap property as it is, or find another. Don't expect repairs or 'finishing'
- we're being asked to put down a £100 deposit. it will go against searches on the property
* ??? YOU do the searches, not the estate agent or seller. A small deposit is sometimes requested as a goodwill gesture of seriousness, but make sure
a) it is refundable if Exchange of Contracts does not happen otherwise
b) it goes towards the purchase price
Get that in writing.
but will allow us to get confirmation the flat is ours.
It is not 'yours' for sure till Exchange of Contracts

- the estate agent cannot provide a completed vendor questionnaire
never heard of it
- the estate agent says that the vendor insists that we use their recommended solicitor, its actually part of the terms of sale i.e if we don't use the estate agent's solicitor, we can't buy the property
Refuse. Tell the agent you already have a solicitor and intend to use your usual one. If the seller wishes to withdraw, fine - let him.
Do not compromise on this.
- the solicitor quote t&c's state some extra costs. we've asked for approximate figures for the transfer engrossment fee, fees for the managing agents of the freeholder, and new homes developer fees - none of which can be clarified. They just said they don't know this yet.
That's normal - many fees are are unknown at the start of the process, whichever solicitor you use
- overall the estate agents - who are a large, reputable firm - are being quite monosyllabic with answers on email and generally not helping us move forward.
You do not need more than 'yes'/'no' from them
"Will the seller accept £X00,000?" (Y/N)
"My solicitors are abc. Will the seller proceed?" (Y/N)
We do have an appointment with the in house mortgage advisor who is quite pushy (not unexpected) and it feels everyone works for the same company - therefore we are unsure that we're being truly and fairly represented here.
Find your own independant mortgage adviser.
Do not compromise on this.

Are any of the above viable warning signs or is this just the norm for buyers?

EAs get commission if buyers use their financial adviser. And solicitor. So they have a profit incentive.
Refuse.

There are some alarm bells, but as long as you make clear what you will/won't accept, then proceed.

If the seller really refuses to sell to you because you won't use his solicitor, walk away.

kenzie123

G_M Thank you for your message, that is really useful and helps us a lot.

A note about the seller only wanting us to use the EA solicitor - the reason they have given is that the whole building is owned by one seller. He has sold or is selling all the flats in there (around 10) using the same solicitor and wants to continue like this to make it easier.

Does that sound valid to you?

Agree with you about the mortgage advisor, going to cancel our appointment with him

Thank you again

Ms_Sophia

If the seller wants to use the same solicitor for all of his flats - fine, but that would be a solicitor to represent the seller. You need a solicitor to represent you as a buyer.

If smb was trying to force me to use their solicitor I wouldn't go for it.

eddddy

kenzie123 wrote: »

A note about the seller only wanting us to use the EA solicitor - the reason they have given is that the whole building is owned by one seller. He has sold or is selling all the flats in there (around 10) using the same solicitor and wants to continue like this to make it easier.

Does that sound valid to you?

It's probably valid from the seller's perspective, but not from yours.

The seller may have a formal referral fee arrangement, or perhaps an informal arrangement like "I'll push lots of business your way, and you'll give me good rates in return".

Either way, the solicitor might have an allegiance with the seller, which could work against you.

kenzie123 wrote: »

- the estate agent cannot provide a completed vendor questionnaire

Some EAs ask vendors to fill in these forms they've made up. They are completely worthless. When I sell, I tend not to bother filling them in.

If you have any questions about the property, in the first instance ask the EA (but you can't rely on their answers). If the question is important and you want to rely on the answer, tell your solicitor.


On a more general level, in your situation I'd be tempted to stop 'discussing' stuff, and just put my offer in writing, and wait for the formal reply.

marksoton

kenzie123 wrote: »

A note about the seller only wanting us to use the EA solicitor - the reason they have given is that the whole building is owned by one seller. He has sold or is selling all the flats in there (around 10) using the same solicitor and wants to continue like this to make it easier.

Does that sound valid to you?

It does if you're a greedy naughty EA.

Foxtrot Oscar should be your response.

Taken all in i'd walk away. Sounds like far too much hard work.

But as suggested you could proceed but you'd need to be very firm.

HouseBuyer77

He has sold or is selling all the flats in there (around 10) using the same solicitor and wants to continue like this to make it easier.

I presume he converted the building into flats then? Odd that he apparently didn't finish the job.

It has the smell of something fishy (there's a big problem he's trying to hide and just sell everything ASAP) but equally it may all be fine. Perhaps he ran out of money converting and is now selling cheaply so he can get away with asking the buyers to finish up.

Still proceed with caution, definitely use your own solicitor. Are you having any kind of survey? Whilst it may be a new flat. It's an unfinished conversion of an old building so getting a professional in to check things over would be a good idea.

Find out why the conversion wasn't finished.

G_M

I answered as clearly as I could, so can only repeat:

Use your own solicitor.
Use your own financial adviser
Do not compromise on this.

I agree strange that seller seems to be converting the whole building but has not finished. Again, I repeat - it sounds like he has run out of cash to finish (or has just bid at auction for another building and needs cash fast.....)

The other potential issue might be that he does not have the required Planning Permission and/or Building Regulations certification for the conversion.

This is something your solicitor and surveyor should check - though if you use his solicitor it might get 'over-looked........'

moneyistooshorttomention

G_M has made many valid points - I'd go with what he says in your position.

My feeling is it basically downs to a fire sale by a desperate vendor - and hence the lack of finishing and cheaper price.

AFAIK - there is one vendor questionnaire and one vendor questionnaire only. That vendor questionnaire is the one the vendor has to fill in by law (via his solicitor - NOT his estate agent). That is the questionnaire that asks all those awkward little questions many vendors would prefer not to answer (eg the infamous "Is there any neighbour dispute or anything that might cause a neighbour dispute?").

That (legal) questionnaire has to be filled in accurately by the vendor and any lies on it can cause them to cop it for having done "misrepresentation".

It is a VERY valuable document to make sure you have and do NOT ever throw it away in case you need it in the future (ie if you can see that someone somewhere is telling you lies - and you wish to prove it).

Humphrey2012

Just a little bit of info...

We have had to fill in the questionnaire for our solicitor relating to the sale of our house. This is the legal document.

I did also have to fill in a questionnaire for the estate agent, right at the start before the house went on the market. However, I got the impression this was more for the Estate Agency staff's benefit so that they had the answers to the most common questions on hand. It probably also cover the EA as is any info they give is later proven to be incorrect, they can refer to their questionnaire and prove it was me who was wrong!!

I don't think the EA questionnaire was passed on to buyers, but the solicitor's one is.

I won't get into the other points as I agree with all the help given re solicitor choice etc.

princeofpounds

- There is no such thing as a 'sellers' questionnaire' provided by the EA. At most this is just some voluntary information that forms part of the marketing material. The seller has to answer certain questions to your solicitor, that's what you should rely on.


- The points made about lawyers above are correct. The EA is probably insisting on this for their commission, and perhaps to smooth over any issues with the building.


- I've not heard of a purchase where you need to pay an irregular deposit like this. You normally show willingness by instructing a lawyer and/or surveyor, so the vendor knows you have spent money on the transaction.


- I would be highly cautious about getting involved in an apartment block where the other owner clearly has cashflow problems. You will be tied to them through the freehold.

we have been looking for a long time (about a year without success), we're in London, and are desperate to get on the ladder.

They can see you coming from a mile off, especially as you are quite clearly uncertain about what is normal in a housing transaction and what is 'off'.