BT - Excessive and punitive leaving charges

bxboards

jem16 wrote: »

That sounds like the most likely reason considering that BT had told you the line would be cancelled on the 15th. .

Yes, I thought that was most likely too, as the 15th lined up with when TalkTalk cancelled the fibre part of the order.

I've spoken to TalkTalk 3 or 4 times, and one call handler even contacted Openreach using his reseller ID but it seems the failure isn't clear to go ahead isn't clear, as I was (and still am) on BT infinity 1 and my line is working and didn't cease...

It's all baffling too be honest! TalkTalk think even if I try to switch again and they can still apply the offers and promitions I missed out on, there is a good chance BT or Openreach or whoever will block it again.

jem16

bxboards wrote: »

but it seems the failure isn't clear to go ahead isn't clear, as I was (and still am) on BT infinity 1 and my line is working and didn't cease...

I would have thought a cease order would still require a certain amount of time to go through - that may be 14 days as that is the cooling off period. So 14 days from the 15th would be the 29th December.

It's all baffling too be honest! TalkTalk think even if I try to switch again and they can still apply the offers and promitions I missed out on, there is a good chance BT or Openreach or whoever will block it again.

Your first port of call should be to phone BT and get them to cancel the cancellation ( cease order ). When that has been done you should be free to sign up for TalkTalk again. I would phone BT asap.

BT should never have applied a cancellation if TalkTalk had provided them with notice for you to switch. Whether it's happened because you contacted them after receiving the email you posted above I have no idea.

iniltous

If you cancel your contract before the minimum term has ended, and that won't really matter if you cancel 1 day into the term or with 1 day left, they charge you for the equipment, the amount you pay in compensation for the 'rental' is tapered so obviously if only a few days left then it isn't going to be much...the date they delivered the equipment isn't going to be the contractual date, that will be the date the service started
Switching is gaining provider led, so you shouldn't have to tell BT anything, they are informed by virtue of Talk Talk requesting to take ownership of the line, that triggers the losing provider (BT in your case) to send a letter saying is it genuine that you want to leave, obviously real scope for providers to 'slam' customers .
You obviously would like to move on the anniversary of the contract ,if it's a 12 month minimum term, but personally I would have let the minimum term expire, then moved, just so the problems you are having wouldn't occur, as far as missing a deal, they are like buses , there will be another one along soon
Why the move isn't taking place ?, could be anything, BT obviously could stop it, normally when you receive the 'sorry to see you go' letter, if you didn't want to move, because you never asked a new company to provide service, BT has the ability to stop the move (quite reasonably).. The new provider TT could cancel the move, or Openreach may decide that the procedure wasn't followed correctly and stop the move taking place, you would probably never know for sure where the problem was, as they will all seek to blame anyone but themselves

bxboards

iniltous wrote: »

If you cancel your contract before the minimum term has ended, and that won't really matter if you cancel 1 day into the term or with 1 day left, they charge you for the equipment, the amount you pay in compensation for the 'rental' is tapered so obviously if only a few days left then it isn't going to be much...the date they delivered the equipment isn't going to be the contractual date, that will be the date the service started
Switching is gaining provider led, so you shouldn't have to tell BT anything, they are informed by virtue of Talk Talk requesting to take ownership of the line, that triggers the losing provider (BT in your case) to send a letter saying is it genuine that you want to leave, obviously real scope for providers to 'slam' customers .
You obviously would like to move on the anniversary of the contract ,if it's a 12 month minimum term, but personally I would have let the minimum term expire, then moved, just so the problems you are having wouldn't occur, as far as missing a deal, they are like buses , there will be another one along soon
Why the move isn't taking place ?, could be anything, BT obviously could stop it, normally when you receive the 'sorry to see you go' letter, if you didn't want to move, because you never asked a new company to provide service, BT has the ability to stop the move (quite reasonably).. The new provider TT could cancel the move, or Openreach may decide that the procedure wasn't followed correctly and stop the move taking place, you would probably never know for sure where the problem was, as they will all seek to blame anyone but themselves

Thanks - I haven't cancelled my contract early at all, the the new switch was timed to take over 1 day after my BT contract expired.

I've not done anything wrong here - which is really the purpose of the whole thread too be honest!

Ultimately, BT seemed to imply my switch was two days early.

Now having done an experiment, I'm sure these problems are BT end.

I did a dummy switch to TT Simply Broadband which was due to start on 6th Jan. 'Your Estimated Go Live Date Broadband and Phone: 6th Jan 2016'

I got an immediate 'leaving' mail from BT telling me I was leaving on 5th Jan so BT seem to be consistently reporting things are happening one day earlier.

'Dear xxxx, Another service provider has told us you want to move your phone line and broadband over to them on 05-Jan-2016. So we're taking this as notice that you want to stop these services with us on that date.
If that's not right, or you've changed your mind, please get in touch with us on 0800 028 3098 as soon as you can. The sooner you call us the easier it is to change things. If we don't hear from you by 2pm on 01-Jan-2016, your services will automatically be moved on 05-Jan-2016.'


So it seems to me even if the end user (me) times the switch for a certain date, BT are reporting it 1 day earlier consistantly, even though Openreach will not do it until the day the new provider reports.

iniltous

If TT say the takeover is the 6th , then I would have though it correct that BT would say the last day is the 5th , otherwise you would be paying 2x line rental for 1 day, the wording on the email could be better, if it said ' another provider wants to take your line over on the 6th, so your last day with us is the 5th' would be clearer
The crux of the matter here is what day your BT contract minimum term expired, when you approached TT , they don't know or care when you are out of minimum term with your current provider, they interrogate a common system all providers use and get the earliest date Openreach can do some work, unless you specify a particular date, or more likely say a 'not before' date....I'm not blaming you, what I do believe though is that if you had given a date of the anniversary of your BT contract start plus a day or two, you wouldn't be having these problems.
...I would say you need to examine your first BT bill and see what the first date they billed you for was , and if that is not more that 366 days before the TT takeover date, you cancelled early, even if it was only a day or two
If you can prove that your BT minimum term expired at least the day before TT took over the line, by referring you your initial BT bill, and the first day you paid them for line rental, then , as they can also see that date, if the equipment charge isn't appropriate they should remove it,
Did you let TT arrange the removal of BT, or did you, having got a date from TT , then contact BT and give them notice of your intention to leave, the migration process doesn't need you to contact your 'old' provider at all, and could mess things up especially if giving an estimated date

bxboards

iniltous wrote: »

If TT say the takeover is the 6th , then I would have though it correct that BT would say the last day is the 5th , otherwise you would be paying 2x line rental for 1 day, the wording on the email could be better, if it said ' another provider wants to take your line over on the 6th, so your last day with us is the 5th' would be clearer
The crux of the matter here is what day your BT contract minimum term expired, when you approached TT , they don't know or care when you are out of minimum term with your current provider, they interrogate a common system all providers use and get the earliest date Openreach can do some work, unless you specify a particular date, or more likely say a 'not before' date....I'm not blaming you, what I do believe though is that if you had given a date of the anniversary of your BT contract start plus a day or two, you wouldn't be having these problems.
...I would say you need to examine your first BT bill and see what the first date they billed you for was , and if that is not more that 366 days before the TT takeover date, you cancelled early, even if it was only a day or two
If you can prove that your BT minimum term expired at least the day before TT took over the line, by referring you your initial BT bill, and the first day you paid them for line rental, then , as they can also see that date, if the equipment charge isn't appropriate they should remove it,
Did you let TT arrange the removal of BT, or did you, having got a date from TT , then contact BT and give them notice of your intention to leave, the migration process doesn't need you to contact your 'old' provider at all, and could mess things up especially if giving an estimated date

All this has been covered already in the thread really, see post 3 where BT claimed I'd reset the contract because I activated the 'free' caller privacy stuff.

I had two days between the TT and BT end date.

It appears BT put a 'cease' order on my line on 15th.

I could have left BT on that date, TT wanted to move me on 16th originally but this moved to 17th but was blocked by what appears to be a 'cease' order.

I agree the wording on the BT mail is unclear, but remember a switch can occur up to midnight on the switch day, so I'm not sure how BT can really claim that a simultaneous switch occurs one day earlier from their point of view, as they would be providing the services right up until the switch.

In m dummy move example, the service would not cut off on the 5th and resume on the 6th, the outtage is around 30 minutes while Openreach do the switch at the exchange.

jem16

iniltous wrote: »

If TT say the takeover is the 6th , then I would have though it correct that BT would say the last day is the 5th

I've never had different dates in the various switches I've done recently.

My recent move from PlusNet to Sky saw exactly the same date being used and I stayed connected to PlusNet till that date. On the date given I had a downtime of around 15 minutes whilst the BT Openreach engineer swapped over at the exchange.

That's what I would expect to happen in all cases where a number is being transferred - BT had no right to put a cease order on the line as a gainer led provider switch was happening.

jem16

bxboards wrote: »

I did a dummy switch to TT Simply Broadband

How do you do a "dummy switch"?

Anyway have you phoned BT and asked them to remove the cease order?

Perhaps you should email BT CEO.

bxboards

jem16 wrote: »

How do you do a "dummy switch"?

Anyway have you phoned BT and asked them to remove the cease order?

Perhaps you should email BT CEO.

I placed a new order with TalkTalk.
I then cancelled it, the same day as soon as the 'leaving BT' message was sent, as my contention has always been BT are wrong, and I think I've got solid proof they are reporting the change 1 day prior.

I have a Complaint in with BT.
Dido Harding's office is also looking at this from TalkTalk's side.

[Deleted User]

iniltous wrote: »

what I do believe though is that if you had given a date of the anniversary of your BT contract start plus a day or two, you wouldn't be having these problems.

I think this is the crux of the problem too.