Which to go first, cash ISA or NSI index linked bonds

Stubod

Hi Eco..very impressive....what sort of average %'age are you able to get?....my calcs are a very pessimistic (hopefully) 1.5%...so will need to burn a lot of cash to generate and annual income of about £24k per year...

polymaff

masonic wrote: »

I'm not preventing you from having your opinion. Nor am I preventing you from expressing it.

Oh dear. My "Others" refers to all those you are recommending not to follow my advice to read the T&Cs.

Take some time to get together and present some evidence supporting your belief that the NS&I T&Cs are not clear - and stop discouraging others from doing so, stop mis-quoting me or attributing such nonsense as you have to me.

polymaff

Eco_Miser wrote: »

I've been on "zero" income for nearly seven years. In practice the interest and dividends have exceeded my outgoings in all but one year - the year I got a new bathroom.

Similarly here. I guess that the only fly in the ointment is the inflation of those asset-sapping future costs one might face as one grows older - inflation well in excess of general inflation. (or is that ?)

masonic

polymaff wrote: »

Oh dear. My "Others" refers to all those you are recommending not to follow my advice to read the T&Cs.

I have not recommended that they don't read the T&Cs, indeed, they should have already read them if they hold this product. I was merely questioning your motives for sending them there given that you know they are unclear on this point.

polymaff wrote: »

Take some time to get together and present some evidence supporting your belief that the NS&I T&Cs are not clear - and stop discouraging others from doing so, stop mis-quoting me or attributing such nonsense as you have to me.

I am not discouraging anyone else from presenting evidence, and I don't think have I misquoted you (please provide details if you disagree), so I'm not sure why you are throwing around these accusations.

In terms of evidence, I'm only too happy to submit the following post for starters: http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showpost.php?p=69513963&postcount=30

If the T&Cs were clear on this point, then why would you go to the trouble of phoning Money Box in order to clarify what they meant?

polymaff

The evidence, masonic ....

You used the term "ambiguous definition", not me.

Take your time.

masonic

polymaff wrote: »

The evidence, masonic ....

You used the term "ambiguous definition", not me.

Take your time.

The ambiguity is introduced by stating "the Retail Prices Index compiled by the Office for National Statistics, or any Index replacing it" while not specifying by whom or under what circumstances. One poster stated that they believed it referred to the ONS ceasing to publish RPI data, under which circumstances NS&I would be forced to use whatever measure the ONS deemed the replacement for RPI and had therefore made provisions to do just that. That is a reasonable interpretation whether or not correct, in my opinion, of course.

polymaff

masonic wrote: »

The ambiguity is introduced by stating "the Retail Prices Index compiled by the Office for National Statistics, or any Index replacing it" while not specifying by whom or under what circumstances. One poster stated that they believed it referred to the ONS ceasing to publish RPI data, under which circumstances NS&I would be forced to use whatever measure the ONS deemed the replacement for RPI and had therefore made provisions to do just that. That is a reasonable interpretation whether or not correct, in my opinion, of course.

NS&I are unambiguously reserving their right to unilaterally move from the ONS RPI to any other index. If you or the other offerers of opinions you quote are venturing how they - and you - think that should be interpreted they are within their rights - but that is not evidence, just speculation, and needs to be recognised, and valued, as such.

Moreover, MSEers should be encouraged to read the T&C definition for themselves and make their decisions accordingly.

Finis.

Eco_Miser

Stubod wrote: »

Hi Eco..very impressive....what sort of average %'age are you able to get?....my calcs are a very pessimistic (hopefully) 1.5%...so will need to burn a lot of cash to generate and annual income of about £24k per year...

Overall, about 3%.
It helps that I don't need to spend much, so the nice safe higher interest current and regular saver accounts can provide a higher proportion of my income than of yours. It also helps that I can spend one bit of capital, while equivalent income accumulates elsewhere.

masonic

polymaff wrote: »

NS&I are unambiguously reserving their right to unilaterally move from the ONS RPI to any other index. If you or the other offerers of opinions you quote are venturing how they - and you - think that should be interpreted they are within their rights - but that is not evidence, just speculation, and needs to be recognised, and valued, as such.

Moreover, MSEers should be encouraged to read the T&C definition for themselves and make their decisions accordingly.

Your opinion that it is unambiguous is mere speculation on your part and in direct contradiction with you own prior actions to seek clarification as to what the term meant. Sending people on a wild goose chase to read the T&Cs and come up with their own interpretation, while withholding information that clarifies the situation is unhelpful.

For anyone who has a different interpretation of the statement and is unhappy with how NS&I decide to interpret it, the final arbiter of what the term should be taken to mean will be the FOS. The burden of proof on the customer is therefore merely to satisfy an impartial third party that they could have reasonably interpreted the meaning of the term differently. Therefore, how the statement could be reasonably interpreted is absolutely relevant to whether or not NS&I could enforce a different interpretation that is less favourable to the customer.

Edit: and on the subject of unilateral changes to a contract that are to the customer's detriment, I'm sure you'll be aware that when such a change is made, the customer must be allowed to dissolve the contract without any barrier to their exit. So NS&I would have to waive their usual penalty for early withdrawal if they changed from RPI to a less generous measure mid-contract.