Fish tank damaged, help

ballyclover

yet again no one is reading this correctly.

They have turned round and told me that the damage could not have been caused by them or by thier suppliers. They have offered to take the item back for inspection. Yep this is great,

But they have already told me the damage could not be thier fault. Items returned would be subject to carrier charges to them and return to me. So why would i return an item that they have already made thier mind up was not thier problem. How and why do i need to prove it wasn't me. I can honestly say it wasnt.There are no circumstances in anyway that i could have done the damage.

I am not asking for anything for free,but they have already more or less made the decsion, how can that be fair?

So i send it back and they say, yep as we said not our fault now you pay for its return and for our costs? Sure they are going to say that arent they?

So the burden of proof you are saying is mine, i more or less cannot win

boo_star

ballyclover wrote: »

yet again no one is reading this correctly.

They have turned round and told me that the damage could not have been caused by them or by thier suppliers. They have offered to take the item back for inspection. Yep this is great,

But they have already told me the damage could not be thier fault. Items returned would be subject to carrier charges to them and return to me. So why would i return an item that they have already made thier mind up was not thier problem. How and why do i need to prove it wasn't me. I can honestly say it wasnt.There are no circumstances in anyway that i could have done the damage.

I am not asking for anything for free,but they have already more or less made the decsion, how can that be fair?

So i send it back and they say, yep as we said not our fault now you pay for its return and for our costs? Sure they are going to say that arent they?

So the burden of proof you are saying is mine, i more or less cannot win

They said it's not their fault. That doesn't mean it isn't the fault of the delivery company.

The whole "if you sign for it means you have accepted it" thing is unenforceable but you really should return it. If you don't they have every right to refuse your request(s).

ballyclover

boo_star wrote: »

They said it's not their fault. That doesn't mean it isn't the fault of the delivery company.

The whole "if you sign for it means you have accepted it" thing is unenforceable but you really should return it. If you don't they have every right to refuse your request(s).

I don't understand this, if i return it what would be the point? They are just going to say, as suspected its damage caused by you not us, now you have to pay for the return... They have already told me this. So it would appear there is nothing i can do. Its my word against thiers and they hold all the cards

marliepanda

ballyclover wrote: »

I don't understand this, if i return it what would be the point? They are just going to say, as suspected its damage caused by you not us, now you have to pay for the return... They have already told me this. So it would appear there is nothing i can do. Its my word against thiers and they hold all the cards

Do you have the exact wording of what they ask you to do before accepting the delivery and what you actually said to them? Not anecdotal, what is actually printed in the 'contract of sale' or whatever you have, and whatever correspondence you sent to them saying the damage you could not see.

wealdroam

A fault appearing during the first six months can be assumed to have been present at the time of delivery, and it is for the seller to prove otherwise.

In my opinion, they have not provided that proof. The manufacturer telling them "it could not have been damaged before delivery" is not proof.

Yes I know that you also have the right to reject the tank within the first thirty days - I even wrote that in post #4 on this thread - but you appear to have no intention of doing that.

Is the damage something that you could live with, or is it such that there is no way that you want to keep this tank no matter how much 'compensation' you get?
For example, you have told us that £50 store voucher is not acceptable, but is a £50 refund to your debit card ok?

The answer to that question really helps to define your next action

Perhaps you could get a local aquarium seller to inspect the damage.
Perhaps you should send a letter before action with a view to taking court action.
Without knowing what is acceptable to you, it is difficult to suggest anything else.

wealdroam

ballyclover wrote: »

I don't understand this, if i return it what would be the point? They are just going to say, as suspected its damage caused by you not us, now you have to pay for the return... They have already told me this. So it would appear there is nothing i can do. Its my word against thiers and they hold all the cards

The point is that you have the right to reject the goods and they have to prove that you caused the damage - not just accuse you of doing so.

daytona0

ballyclover wrote: »

I don't understand this, if i return it what would be the point? They are just going to say, as suspected its damage caused by you not us, now you have to pay for the return... They have already told me this. So it would appear there is nothing i can do. Its my word against thiers and they hold all the cards

Well firstly it may be damage which is CLEARLY (provable) your fault, not to accuse you of anything but people aren't all morally upstanding when it comes to consumer damage with a £1k item. Pardon the pun but they should be given the opportunity to fish out the flakes. :cool:

Secondly, it may be a manufacturer defect in which case they'll find it and sort it out under SOGA etc

Thirdly, it may be a transit issue. They are entitled to inspect their item before making a claim through the courier for damage, to make sure it is a legitimate claim.

They don't hold "all of the cards" because, unless they have CONCRETE proof that you caused the damage (which is a fair outcome), you can take them to court and likely win when they fail to show that the damage (which wasn't possible to observe when not full) was caused by you.


As a practical solution I would consider whether this problem is actually anything more than cosmetic, as £50 isn't *too* bad based solely on your word (you could be blagging them for all anyone knows!). You might even be able to squeeze out £100 from them based solely on your word, so if you can put up with the damage then this option may be more viable (in my opinion).

boo_star

ballyclover wrote: »

I don't understand this, if i return it what would be the point? They are just going to say, as suspected its damage caused by you not us, now you have to pay for the return... They have already told me this. So it would appear there is nothing i can do. Its my word against thiers and they hold all the cards

Why are you ruling out damage caused by the delivery company?

JimmyTheWig

Any damage up to the point of you receiving it is up to them to sort out.
Any damage after that is up to you to sort out.

You believe it is up to them.
They believe it is up to you.

Either...
1. You convince them that it is their problem
2. They convince you that it is your problem
3. They give in and decide it is better to refund you than keep arguing about it
4. You give in and decide it is better to keep the damaged tank than keep arguing about it
5. You meet some way in the middle (e.g. they offer something better than a £50 credit)
6. You take them to court

2 doesn't seem like it is going to happen.
I can't see 3 happening - this tank wouldn't be resellable (presumably) and so would cost them a lot of money.
1 might be achieved by you sending it back, but it seems doubtful.
4 doesn't sound like something that you're interested in.
So it comes down to 5 or 6.

If it goes to court, I believe the court would take a dim view if the company had suggested that you return it and you haven't.
So to go down that route I think you'd have to return it. That may result in scenario 1, which would be great, but it doesn't sound likely. But at least you've given them a chance. If they still disagree that it is their problem then take them to court. If you can get a local, independent expert to confirm in writing that the damage wouldn't have been caused by you then I'd have thought that you should win. The company will have to pay your costs for the independent report, too.

Or you make a compromise. Your call on how much you want the hassle of court, how bad the damage is and how much you can get out of them.

ballyclover

Had a conversation with them this morning, they have said they are willing to take the tank back and examine the damage. They have also said that they didn't actually have a conversation with the manufactour it was with a rep of the company. I have got down from my high horse and hopefully agreed a compromise of £100.00 cash refund, towards the costs of repairs if possible. This would appear to me to be the best solution for us both, saving time and effort and further costs involved in shipping.


They have said they are considering this and will be back in touch by the weekend.


I think this is a fair outcome, if out course that is the outcome. If not I will ask for the tank to be returned, inspected and then I will have to fight that battle if they still stick to their guns