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PCM UK (again)
gmitchell
Posts: 16 Forumite
Bit of background. Our local station is being knocked around by Crossrail development and had a turning circle. Still has 5 marked bays and an underground car park access for the huge block of flats.
Construction work has closed this turning circle so the only place to turn and or drop off people using the station is the entrance to the underground car park for the flats. PCM UK manage all of this private road area. No possibility of stopping anywhere else around due to Council traffic wardens and CCTV.
So three weeks ago now we drew up to this aforementioned entrance when I saw a woman in a black coat using her phone to take a picture of the car. I thought that this maybe one of the PCM operators, later confirmed. I got out of the passenger side to ask her why she was taking a picture of the car, only reply ‘This is a closed’ road. Asked her to stop taking pictures, no reply. Asked her to delete the pictures she’d just taken, reply was ‘I don’t know’. Apparent then that she was from PCM UK.
The ‘Evidence’ she took was of me getting out of the passenger side of the car, trying to obscure the registration no with the reversing light clearly showing in the pictures. No picture of the driver despite the operative speaking to the driver. Also a picture of the signage. Any signage in that area would require the driver to stop, get out, read the signage, therefore ‘agreeing’ to their ‘contract’.
Other drivers were stopping there and I asked if all others would get tickets, she said yes. Apparently she has issued tickets to lots of the construction workers too. No friends there then, one of them spoke to me from his van.
I’d apparent ‘distracted’ her from issuing another ticket whilst carrying out a protracted argument. I said that in common with Council wardens that if she was intending to issue a ticket or PCM UK to issue an NTK that I’d like to see her ID. She printed a ticket out and I said this wasn’t sufficient. She then produced her photo ID.
To this date we’ve received no NTK, this maybe because an actual ticket was issued, not to the driver I might add, so need some advice on that.
2nd, the pictures show the car intending to reverse to make a turn, the only means at that location you can do that. My appeal would be on those grounds that the car was not ‘parked’, a car has to physically stop to engage reverse.
3rd, signage is such that a driver has to stop, etc. as mentioned before.
4th, PCM UK now do not appear on the AOS approved operators list despite their tickets and signage showing they are.
Any advice on the next steps would be much appreciated.
Construction work has closed this turning circle so the only place to turn and or drop off people using the station is the entrance to the underground car park for the flats. PCM UK manage all of this private road area. No possibility of stopping anywhere else around due to Council traffic wardens and CCTV.
So three weeks ago now we drew up to this aforementioned entrance when I saw a woman in a black coat using her phone to take a picture of the car. I thought that this maybe one of the PCM operators, later confirmed. I got out of the passenger side to ask her why she was taking a picture of the car, only reply ‘This is a closed’ road. Asked her to stop taking pictures, no reply. Asked her to delete the pictures she’d just taken, reply was ‘I don’t know’. Apparent then that she was from PCM UK.
The ‘Evidence’ she took was of me getting out of the passenger side of the car, trying to obscure the registration no with the reversing light clearly showing in the pictures. No picture of the driver despite the operative speaking to the driver. Also a picture of the signage. Any signage in that area would require the driver to stop, get out, read the signage, therefore ‘agreeing’ to their ‘contract’.
Other drivers were stopping there and I asked if all others would get tickets, she said yes. Apparently she has issued tickets to lots of the construction workers too. No friends there then, one of them spoke to me from his van.
I’d apparent ‘distracted’ her from issuing another ticket whilst carrying out a protracted argument. I said that in common with Council wardens that if she was intending to issue a ticket or PCM UK to issue an NTK that I’d like to see her ID. She printed a ticket out and I said this wasn’t sufficient. She then produced her photo ID.
To this date we’ve received no NTK, this maybe because an actual ticket was issued, not to the driver I might add, so need some advice on that.
2nd, the pictures show the car intending to reverse to make a turn, the only means at that location you can do that. My appeal would be on those grounds that the car was not ‘parked’, a car has to physically stop to engage reverse.
3rd, signage is such that a driver has to stop, etc. as mentioned before.
4th, PCM UK now do not appear on the AOS approved operators list despite their tickets and signage showing they are.
Any advice on the next steps would be much appreciated.
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Comments
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Hi OP,
I know the location you are referring to and am aware of the tactics being used. Feel free to message me and I'll be happy to fill you in.
I have spoken to PCM and found them very heavy handed and have collected evidence of their tactics in order to begin an appeal via the approved IPC process as the original appeal was rejected.
There is an active local forum where many other people have suffered the same illogical issuing of NTK invoices, in some cases for vehicles who didn't even stop.
As of today the enforcement officers appear have fled the site and are nowhere to be seen.0 -
Was she wearing a uniform which is required by CoP?0
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andycris3107 wrote: »Hi OP,
I know the location you are referring to and am aware of the tactics being used. Feel free to message me and I'll be happy to fill you in.
I have spoken to PCM and found them very heavy handed and have collected evidence of their tactics in order to begin an appeal via the approved IPC process as the original appeal was rejected.
There is an active local forum where many other people have suffered the same illogical issuing of NTK invoices, in some cases for vehicles who didn't even stop.
As of today the enforcement officers appear have fled the site and are nowhere to be seen.
I'll PM you in a sec. Saw one of their regular male operatives there this morning. Another snap happy employee.
They're there more than ever now as it's bonanza time for them with people having to stop in the road to turn and hitting the construction workers with tickets too0 -
I was after advice of how to construct the appeal as I can't use the bit about the NTK as one hasn't arrived.
Trying to say that the car has to stop to reverse.0 -
I was after advice of how to construct the appeal as I can't use the bit about the NTK as one hasn't arrived.
Trying to say that the car has to stop to reverse.
If you have a windscreen ticket, the NEWBIES thread tells you to appeal as keeper around day 20 as many PPCs forget to send a NTK once they get an appeal.
If they forget, then the NTK is non POFA 2012 and becomes a winning appeal point.
Signs normally say no stopping as well as no parking. They will get you any way they can.
The problem is that the IPC uses a kangaroo court appeals system. You will probably lose no matter what you put in it.
Some say don't appeal to IPC, some do. I'm one of the latter as win or lose it costs the PPC money and they wouldn't want such a daft result put in front of a judge, so court is unlikely.
Please read the Sticky thread for NEWBIES before you send your appeal.
Do not pay, do not ignore, do not reveal who was driving, do not miss the appeal deadline. Never, ever 'phone a parking scumpany.
Your local press might be interested in this.I married my cousin. I had to...I don't have a sister.
All my screwdrivers are cordless."You're Safety Is My Primary Concern Dear" - Laks0 -
If you have a windscreen ticket, the NEWBIES thread tells you to appeal as keeper around day 20 as many PPCs forget to send a NTK once they get an appeal.
If they forget, then the NTK is non POFA 2012 and becomes a winning appeal point.
Signs normally say no stopping as well as no parking. They will get you any way they can.
The problem is that the IPC uses a kangaroo court appeals system. You will probably lose no matter what you put in it.
Some say don't appeal to IPC, some do. I'm one of the latter as win or lose it costs the PPC money and they wouldn't want such a daft result put in front of a judge, so court is unlikely.
Please read the Sticky thread for NEWBIES before you send your appeal.
Do not pay, do not ignore, do not reveal who was driving, do not miss the appeal deadline. Never, ever 'phone a parking scumpany.
Your local press might be interested in this.
The tickets was handed to me after the car had departed as I wanted and insisted on seeing the operatives ID. Why hand it to a passenger? So if they issue a ticket, not to the driver in this case, will they issue an NTK?
There is an active post in a Streelife forum about that particular location and protests to the local MP for that area.0 -
For compliance with POFA 2012 a Notice To Driver must be fixed to the car or handed to the driver. If the NTD isn't compliant then even if they send a Notice To Keeper there can be no keeper liability.The tickets was handed to me after the car had departed as I wanted and insisted on seeing the operatives ID. Why hand it to a passenger? So if they issue a ticket, not to the driver in this case, will they issue an NTK?0 -
For compliance with POFA 2012 a Notice To Driver must be fixed to the car or handed to the driver. If the NTD isn't compliant then even if they send a Notice To Keeper there can be no keeper liability.
So I can appeal and just say as the ticket was handed to me (a passenger) then it's invalid?0
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