Personal Savings Allowance guide

moneyfoolish

The personal taxation system is a farce and is incomprehensible for many people. I suspect HMRC are collecting a fortune from ordinary people who don't understand it and just accept whatever they are charged. My Tax Calculation statement for 2015/16 is a perfect example of how confusing it can be. The previous year they had correctly calculated that I had underpaid and had adjusted my tax code to pay back over2015/16. On my 2015/16 statement the "Result" section showed "Total tax payable" and "Tax you've already paid". The result of this was that I was now owed approx £120. However, the "Total tax payable" figure should have been the basic rate tax on my taxable income plus the amount I owed from the previous year and when I added those figures up they came to £212 more than the "Total tax payable" figure. Sometime later I received my Annual Tax Summary and realised that in the earlier Tax Statement there had been no mention of the £1060 Marriage Allowance Transfer from my wife even though they must have know about it because the amount they owed me was correct so this had been included in the calculation but not shown on the form or shown in my allowances. Goodness knows what will happen this year when they have to include untaxed interest!

schiff

If only politicians and the Treasury checked with HMRC that any measures they proposed to change could be fairly simply put into words how they would operate once in place, with any problems they could envisage!

It's not the first time.

polymaff

schiff wrote: »

If only politicians and the Treasury checked with HMRC that any measures they proposed to change could be fairly simply put into words how they would operate once in place, with any problems they could envisage!

That's very true - and HMRC staffers have vehemently let off steam to me - "Why doesn't HMT consult us as to the implementability of their measures?"

That said, it is not that difficult to write design documents for 2016/17, but it does demand discipline. First the high level specification, derived TOTALLY from the legislation. Then the next layer down specifying process - including the sub-processes actually chosen as a means of implementation of the high level spec (after discussion with HMT). Alongside this an Interface specification - format for data coming in and going out.

These steps - very familiar to professional analysts - are all that is required..

A good illustration of how this has gone wrong is Marriage Allowance Transfer. The legislation is very clear - but HMRC have failed to grasp it. In the way of developing an implementation they have chosen to make the output to this process a cash payment rather than a true transfer of Personal Allowance - but not explained it to the public. Then, they publish misleading guidance about who and who could not - might not - benefit - which rapidly transformed into "thou shalt NOT apply" - and they got this so out of conformance to the legislation it is quite unforgiveable.

And they've still got it wrong, even now

Doc_N

Don't blame HMRC for the failings of the tax system. They just operate the crazy rules that politicians graft onto a system that was already creaking 30 years ago - they don't make them.

Would you believe there's actually an Office of Tax Simplification?

"We give independent advice to the government on simplifying the UK tax system. The Office of Tax Simplification is an independent office of HM Treasury."

HMRC is in a mess. The NHS is in a mess. Local Government's in a mess. It isn't their fault, it's the Conservative Government's fault - isn't it about time we started laying the blame at the right door?

Eco_Miser

Doc_N wrote: »

HMRC is in a mess. The NHS is in a mess. Local Government's in a mess. It isn't their fault, it's the Conservative Government's fault - isn't it about time we started laying the blame at the right door?

Well, the Conservative Government certainly aren't helping, but the problems were there before, so we should also blame the Coalition Government, the New Labour Government, the previous Conservative Government, the old Labour Governments, ...

greenglide

But currently they are the only party who could, if they wanted to, actually do anything about it.

But, of course, we are doing the madness of BREXIT instead as no one wants to grasp the real issues.

polymaff

Doc_N wrote: »

Don't blame HMRC for the failings of the tax system.

Who has?

Doc_N wrote: »

[HMRC] just operate the crazy rules that politicians graft onto a system that was already creaking 30 years ago - they don't make them

What nonsense. HMRC have a number of well-defined responsibilities with regard to FY 2016/17 which they have significantly failed to address.

Doc_N

polymaff wrote: »

Who has?



What nonsense. HMRC have a number of well-defined responsibilities with regard to FY 2016/17 which they have significantly failed to address.

Who has? You have, with comments like this:

"HMRC timescales are slipping badly at present. You might like to log into the HMRC website where there should be a timeline for a response to outstanding matters.

Not that I'd believe a word of what it says there"

You're forgetting how HMRC is funded, and who's adding all the new legislation and attendant complexities. It's funded by the Government, and if HMG cuts the funding to such an extent that HMRC can't function effectively because of lack of staff and inadequate IT systems it's not going to be able to perform very well, is it? Ever tried running a race with one leg tied up? Exactly the same with the NHS - the managers get all the blame and the government, which is the real cause of all the problems because it doesn't provide sufficient funding, gets off the hook.

polymaff

Doc_N wrote: »

Who has? You have, with comments like this:

"HMRC timescales are slipping badly at present. You might like to log into the HMRC website where there should be a timeline for a response to outstanding matters.

Not that I'd believe a word of what it says there"

You're forgetting how HMRC is funded, and who's adding all the new legislation and attendant complexities. It's funded by the Government, and if HMG cuts the funding to such an extent that HMRC can't function effectively because of lack of staff and inadequate IT systems it's not going to be able to perform very well, is it? Ever tried running a race with one leg tied up? Exactly the same with the NHS - the managers get all the blame and the government, which is the real cause of all the problems because it doesn't provide sufficient funding, gets off the hook.

If you think that my considered statements can be extrapolated into your OT ranting, then you are much mistaken.

Doc_N

polymaff wrote: »

If you think that my considered statements can be extrapolated into your OT ranting, then you are much mistaken.

Sorry to have hurt your sensitivities.

I naively thought I was the one making the considered statements in defence of a beleaguered ill-funded government department unable to defend itself because to do so would mean the instant dismissal of its Chief Executive and Permanent Secretary.

OT ranting? I don't think so - just defending HMRC and other public sector organisations against unfair and unjustified attacks.