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gadgetmind wrote: »Twelve hours a week in my wife's case, but she's paid for 18 hours as one of the days is a Sunday.
She must be counted in the full time figures then, because the 19% of the new employment that isn't full time is, without a doubt, all zero hour contract. Which is utterly terrible.If you think of it as 'us' verses 'them', then it's probably your side that are the villains.0 -
so you / your company supports unlimited immigration
Unlimited from the EU, yes definitely. From elsewhere, it's already a serious PITA to get visas for non-EU workers, so we only do it for really exceptional people.so you can keep your salaries down and keep the profits high
It's not about salaries, it's about there simply not being enough engineers. Yes, employers could fight over those the UK produces, and salaries would spiral even further, but there still wouldn't be enough engineers.
Meanwhile, talented young people in Greece, Spain, etc. would be missing valuable opportunities.
So yes, keep them coming (more please!) and let's grow engineering in the UK rather than cutting off our own air supply simply to keep a few racists quiet.I am not a financial adviser and neither do I play one on television. I might occasionally give bad advice but at least it's free.
Like all religions, the Faith of the Invisible Pink Unicorns is based upon both logic and faith. We have faith that they are pink; we logically know that they are invisible because we can't see them.0 -
gadgetmind wrote: »Unlimited from the EU, yes definitely. From elsewhere, it's already a serious PITA to get visas for non-EU workers, so we only do it for really exceptional people.
It's not about salaries, it's about there simply not being enough engineers. Yes, employers could fight over those the UK produces, and salaries would spiral even further, but there still wouldn't be enough engineers.
Meanwhile, talented young people in Greece, Spain, etc. would be missing valuable opportunities.
So yes, keep them coming (more please!) and let's grow engineering in the UK rather than cutting off our own air supply simply to keep a few racists quiet.
one of the reasons we have a shortage of engineers is that salaries are, in general low (and have been for at least 50 years) compared to other careers.
better for the UK to allow salaries to rise and encourage UK people to become engineers (or stay as engineers).
I agree it is better for your company to hold salaries down and to ignore the downside of ever increasing population, for the UK people.
Sorry you think that concern for the people of the UK, rather than taking the higher moral ground of your company's profit, is racist, but that says a lot about you and little about people concerned about the quality of life here.0 -
one of the reasons we have a shortage of engineers is that salaries are, in general low (and have been for at least 50 years) compared to other careers.
Our grad starting salary is close to £30k, and pay experienced people multiples of the UK average wage, so I tend to disagree. It's more that it requires taking what are seen as the difficult A levels, and then degrees that keep on piling on the hard work and levels of abstraction.
Other countries have it even worse with their engineer shortages, so pay levels are *much* higher, yet still they have dire shortages. I'm not saying that pay isn't a factor, but educating enough people in the hard stuffSorry you think that concern for the people of the UK, rather than taking the higher moral ground of your company's profit, is racist,
No, think that racism is racist. I'm perfectly happy for people to come to the UK and work here, or for people from the UK to work elsewhere. Others want to pick and choose based on where someone was born and/or the colour of their skin.I am not a financial adviser and neither do I play one on television. I might occasionally give bad advice but at least it's free.
Like all religions, the Faith of the Invisible Pink Unicorns is based upon both logic and faith. We have faith that they are pink; we logically know that they are invisible because we can't see them.0 -
gadgetmind wrote: »Our grad starting salary is close to £30k, and pay experienced people multiples of the UK average wage, so I tend to disagree. It's more that it requires taking what are seen as the difficult A levels, and then degrees that keep on piling on the hard work and levels of abstraction.
Other countries have it even worse with their engineer shortages, so pay levels are *much* higher, yet still they have dire shortages. I'm not saying that pay isn't a factor, but educating enough people in the hard stuff
No, think that racism is racist. I'm perfectly happy for people to come to the UK and work here, or for people from the UK to work elsewhere. Others want to pick and choose based on where someone was born and/or the colour of their skin.
Ok, you believe that unlimited mobility is acceptable indeed desirable.0 -
Ok, you believe that unlimited mobility is acceptable indeed desirable.
It's certainly something we should be moving towards rather than moving away from. Yes, it's not something we can do overnight, or even in just a few years/decades, but it's certainly a worthy goal.I am not a financial adviser and neither do I play one on television. I might occasionally give bad advice but at least it's free.
Like all religions, the Faith of the Invisible Pink Unicorns is based upon both logic and faith. We have faith that they are pink; we logically know that they are invisible because we can't see them.0 -
gadgetmind wrote: »It's certainly something we should be moving towards rather than moving away from. Yes, it's not something we can do overnight, or even in just a few years/decades, but it's certainly a worthy goal.
If it's worthy why not now?
Do you mean there are disadantages that will disappear in the future?
What level do you consider 'good' now ?0 -
If it's worthy why not now?
Because we've got a lot of work to do on absolute poverty first.Do you mean there are disadantages that will disappear in the future?
The word "disappear" suggests it might be magic, but it won't be. It will require a lot of hard work.What level do you consider 'good' now ?
The current EU freedoms work well, and I'd like to see them slowly extended.I am not a financial adviser and neither do I play one on television. I might occasionally give bad advice but at least it's free.
Like all religions, the Faith of the Invisible Pink Unicorns is based upon both logic and faith. We have faith that they are pink; we logically know that they are invisible because we can't see them.0 -
gadgetmind wrote: »Because we've got a lot of work to do on absolute poverty first.
The word "disappear" suggests it might be magic, but it won't be. It will require a lot of hard work.
The current EU freedoms work well, and I'd like to see them slowly extended.
The current EU freedoms keep wages low and so improve company profits at the expense of employees
I guess that could be described as 'working well':
not quite sure what you mean by slowly extended-presumably on the optimum way of keeping wages low.0 -
The current EU freedoms keep wages low and so improve company profits at the expense of employees
They give people choices in life, and personally I like choices. Moreover, I'm happy for others to have the same choices available to them as I do, choices that I take far too much for granted TBH.
When it comes to telling people how to succeed, I like being able to advise people to "study hard, work hard, and at hard things" rather than "choose your womb with care".
We have offices in 25 countries, and if "cheap" was the critical thing, we'd expand elsewhere rather than recruiting in other countries and relocating people.I am not a financial adviser and neither do I play one on television. I might occasionally give bad advice but at least it's free.
Like all religions, the Faith of the Invisible Pink Unicorns is based upon both logic and faith. We have faith that they are pink; we logically know that they are invisible because we can't see them.0
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