What can I do now?

Quentin

You don't want this to be dealt with on the papers alone


Tick B + C!

bargepole

Quentin wrote: »

You don't want this to be dealt with on the papers alone


Tick B + C!

Seconded.

The last thing you want is a case heard on the papers. Boxes B and C, and it will be heard at your local county court.

Then, when they've allocated a date, you will be asked for your witness statement. I will help with that.

poor_country_girl

Hi All - Bargepole! I have my court date - 21st February 2017.

The paperwork is required 14 days prior to this. Just updating now rather than after Christmas so I don't forget with all the stuff I have to do over the next week

Can I just say a MASSIVE thank you and MERRY CHRISTMAS to everyone who has offered me advice here, especially to you Bargepole, you constantly calm me down and make me feel like this is doable, and you have been so wonderful and generous with your time - Thank you

PCG

bargepole

poor_country_girl wrote: »

Hi All - Bargepole! I have my court date - 21st February 2017.

The paperwork is required 14 days prior to this. Just updating now rather than after Christmas so I don't forget with all the stuff I have to do over the next week

I have sent you a private message. This is best dealt with off-forum for now.

poor_country_girl

Hi all

Well today was the court hearing.

I felt very confident after excellent advice from Bargepole who has gone to incredible lengths to assist me through all of this - however I have lost the case and incurred £310.05 costs.

The claimant was invited to give his side of the story first (We were hoping he wouldn't turn up and could ask for his witness statement to be excluded as I wouldn't be able to cross examine him - but he was there)
He gave the facts of the case as he had outlined in his statement but also added that the ticket machine was sensitive to counterfeit coins and that Blackburn had been flooded with counterfeit £1 coins (first I had heard of this!)
so his statement was basically saying there were signs all over the site with the contract of parking and also one on the machine saying if it was faulty not to park.

I was then invited to give my side of the story - so I explained I had used the car park for over 2 years, that the machine was often broken but that a man from the WMC had said it was fine to put a note in the car and pay later - that there hadn't been one occasion when I hadn't returned and payed the fee at lunch or before and that the same coins that hadn't worked in the morning had worked in the afternoon! I explained that I must have done this well over 30 times over the 2 years and never received a ticket establishing this as a custom and practice that had been accepted by them.

I questioned the contract the claimant had supplied to establish the landowners permission to operate - as it was a contract between PCN and the ticket company at the same address - the claimant said this because there was no contract between them directly as he was the agent for the landowner as he was with hundreds of others. - the judge seamed happy with this and asked me if I wanted to question him any more regarding that - to be honest I didn't have a clue what to say at that point.

The judge asked me how the cases i had cited were relevant - so I tried to explain as best I could (I was shaking with nerves by this point!) that I had made every effort to pay for the ticket, this was a minor breach, frustrated contracts - to be honest I was feeling flustered and my calm composure was leaving me quickly.

The judge asked why I hadn't rung the number on the sign - I explained that there were other people there ringing the number to report that the machine was broken, and didn't think more people phoning to report it was needed - and that no where on the sign did it say ring the number to get permission to park - had it, I would have used it.

She asked if either of us had anything more to add - we said no, she sent us out while she deliberated - then called us back in and said she was finding in favor of the claimant as there was a sign saying not to park if the machine was faulty, I parked and did not have a ticket.

She awarded the claimant all his costs, plus travel and parking - he admitted his parking had only cost him £1.80 and not the £2.50 he had originally asked for and she questioned the £10.20 interest he had charged (3p per day) as extortionately high, and allowed him 2p per day.

so for £3.50 I was willing to pay and tried to pay I now have 14 days to find £310.05

I don't think I was brilliant at defending myself and feel like I have let Bargepole down after all his hard work.

What have I learned?
1. my honesty does me no favors - I could have got away with not going back and paying on those days the machine wasn't working and saved myself over £100!
2. be bloody careful where I park in future - and just don't park if I am at all concerned a contract I am entering into! (I remembered today I got a parking ticket many years ago at Deepdale shopping center in Preston for not parking in the lines - the car park was thick with snow and the lines weren't visible!)
3. Perhaps public transport is a safer option...

thanks again all of you who offered advice and support - I really have appreciated it.

Poorer Country Girl.

Coupon-mad

Awww so sorry to read that - this is the small claims lottery for you and you did your best with a decent defence - which court and Judge?

On what basis did she let them claim their costs? Was this person from PCN (NW) Ltd, or a solicitor from CSB Solicitors (Sonny Chall)?

How did £100 become over £300? The defence talked about £70.20 being added on but never actually incurred but they've added on 3 times that (triple recovery) and the Judge swallowed it! Which court?

poor_country_girl

Hi - The person who turned up was James Booth - the director of the Claimant Company

The court was Burnley - the judge was Deputy District Judge Wilson - a youngish woman.

The costs claimed were;
debt - £100
5 letters at £8 per letter - £40
Cost to administer account - £10
Overheads for business inc utility costs, salaries etc - £10
Claim issue fee - £25
Hearing fee - £25
Preparation or paperwork, representation, claim management etc £50
interest (Debt due date to claim issue at 0.03 per day) - £10.20 (this was adjusted)
Travel from home address to court (miles) @45p (100 mile round trip) £45
Parking £2.50 (again, adjusted.)

Total after adjustments £310.05

The Judge just seamed to be happy with everything that came out of his mouth 'ma'am' - I got the feeling that nothing I said would have had any sway on the outcome whatsoever - so chalking it up to experience, learning from my mistakes and walking away from the whole situation and hoping to forget all about it!

Coupon-mad

Burnley court has been a problem before, we have a defendant who has an adjourned case waiting for a new date there and the Judge had no interest in the POFA it seems and reckoned a driver can be an 'agent of a keeper'. So our OP has his work cut out to turn it around when he returns, if those area Judges are this clueless.

This (below) in particular, is an insult and I'm so sorry you got clouted with these unrecoverable costs which are CLEARLY already encompassed within the £100 parking charge:

5 letters at £8 per letter - £40
Cost to administer account - £10
Overheads for business inc utility costs, salaries etc - £10

Sounds like nothing you could have said would have changed the Judge's set mind. So unlucky for you, this is 'DJ roulette' and you got a very, very bad court.

knightstyle

So sorry for you pcg.
Is it against the forum rules if she now sets up crowd funding to pay this and lets us know the details?????

Coupon-mad

It is against forum rules and the only thing people on pepipoo might crowd-fund for would be to fund an appeal, including against the costs order, which erred in law. But this OP wants to put it behind her and no appeal is nailed on to win. Could be more grief and stress.