Bed & ISA during a dip?

Freecall

westy22 wrote: »

If you are holding the ISA and the GIA with the same platform then you can use their Bed & ISA facility to possibly save a re-buy fee and get an almost instantaneous transfer

i think that there is a bit of thread-creep going on here with talk of when to buy investments and what the FTSE100 might do.

The whole principle is to efficiently manage your tax situation, personal investment objectives are an entirely different issue (although as dunstonh says, in order to minimise costs there might be a case for timing with re-balancing).

Timing movements between wrappers to gain a tax advantage has nothing to do with timing the investments themselves.

dunstonh

If you are holding the ISA and the GIA with the same platform then you can use their Bed & ISA facility to possibly save a re-buy fee and get an almost instantaneous transfer but if your GIA and ISA are on different platforms then the method of using cash in hand to effect the transfer is still preferable to selling and waiting 7 days to re-buy when you have no idea what the market will do in the meantime.

Most platforms have a delay and you do not get the same unit price. Even where its a one click process, there is usually a delay unless the platform prefunds sales, switches and purchases. Most do not.

I know exactly how much interest my loss of bank cash will cost me for 7 days (the square root of nothing!).

But that would not be a bed & ISA. The thread title is bed & ISA. However, the first post wording is vague to whether it actually means bed & ISA or to invest from cash. The thread seems to have gone on to market timing from cash although the OP does say in #1 "Lets assume that the investment is staying the same"

If you have VLS60 in the GIA and you bed & ISA to VLS60 in the ISA then the only difference is the time out of the market and unit price movement in that time.

westy22

dunstonh wrote: »

If you have VLS60 in the GIA and you bed & ISA to VLS60 in the ISA then the only difference is the time out of the market and unit price movement in that time.

I agree that is true for a fund, mainly due to the forward pricing.

That is one of the reasons that I prefer to deal in real time with ITs and shares where I can judge exactly what price I am selling at and almost exactly what price I am re-buying at. Of course, you always suffer the spread and also SDRT if applicable on the buy, but that is the price of getting your investments into a tax-free wrapper.

westy22

dunstonh wrote: »

If you have VLS60 in the GIA and you bed & ISA to VLS60 in the ISA then the only difference is the time out of the market and unit price movement in that time.

Only applies if your broker lets you Bed & ISA funds - several don't. From Youinvest (My bold)https://www.youinvest.co.uk/isa/bed-and-isa

''What is a bed and ISA?

A bed and ISA is a pair of deals where an investment is sold in a dealing account and bought in an ISA. The two transactions are carried out together so there is less exposure to market movement. However, the amount of shares bought in the ISA will be less than the amount of shares sold in the dealing account due to the costs deducted – stamp duty, our dealing charge and the difference between the market buying and selling price.

Bed and ISA is available across a wide range of investments including shares, investment trusts, trackers and bonds but you can’t do a bed and ISA in funds (unit trusts and OEICs).''

mad_rich

I'm definitely talking about bed & ISA - no new cash (although I have sufficient cash available if necessary to commit to a new purchase before I've sold).

dunstonh

mad_rich wrote: »

I'm definitely talking about bed & ISA - no new cash (although I have sufficient cash available if necessary to commit to a new purchase before I've sold).

in which case timing doesnt matter as the only difference is time out of the market.