How to deal with fine for crossing a marked bay

typhoon101

Hi. I need some advice regarding a penalty notice I recently received. One day last week was a particularly rainy day and someone had parked their car too far to the left in order to avoid a large puddle that he gathered. This had a knock on effect and all cars who parked after that car were also parked too far to the left meaning their car was outside a marked bay. By the time I got to the car park, there was only one space left which was between two parked cars. I parked my car there and left for work without giving it a second thought.

On returning from work, I found a penalty notice claiming I had not parked within the bounds of a marked bay. Looking at their photographic evidence, my rear tyre was on the bay line. They are now fining me £55

I appealed stating there is no way I could have parked within the bay due to other cars but my appeal was rejected in the grounds that the car park rules are displayed and clearly state I must park within a marked bay (which they are).

Should I just accept this fine? I am very reluctant to pay as I could only park in the available space but technically, I did breech their rules. I can't just ignore their letters as I have already acknowledged the penalty by appealing (or can I)

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks

Fruitcake

Is this a council ticket as you mention fine and penalty? (Parking tickets on private land are not fines, they are speculative invoices.)


If so, pepipoo.com are the experts in this subject. If it was on private land then you need to read the Sticky thread for NEWBIES at the top of the page. We will need details of the parking company and a timeline, plus scans of redacted paperwork (windscreen ticket/notice to owner/keeper.)

typhoon101

Thanks for the reply Fruitcake. This was a private car park. Actually it was an NCP car park at a train station. I prepay for my parking on a weekly basis via the "Ringo" app so that is not in question, just the position of my car. (unfortunatly, by the time the parking attendant came around in the afternoon, most of the cars in the station had cleared, making it impossible for me to prove the fact I just parked in betewen two other cars)

I have now read the NEWBIES sticky, and most of that talks about not appealing. Unfortunately, I have already appealed. (Shame I didn't see this post beforehand!). I only appealed to NCP though, I have not gone to POPLA, which is what my appeal rejection email states I should do.

I am at work now and don't have my windscreen ticket with me, but if you need that, I can scan that later tonight. What timeline are you referring to? Do you mean when did i park and when did I get the ticket? If so, I parked at around 09:30 and arrived back at my car at around 19:30. The ticket was placed (according to the timestamp on the photo) at 14:30.

Where do I go from here?

ManxRed

Oh God, you didn't tell them you were driving did you?

Fruitcake

If you have a PoPLA code then you should use it. I'm not aware of anything in the NEWBIES thread about not appealing unless the PPC is with the IPC not BPA. NCP are with the BPA so you should definitely appeal.


Have a read of the PoPLA Decisions Sticky thread and pick one that best suits your case.


By timeline I mean date you parked and date of NTK. Yes, scan and redact then post everything you have on here. You will need to upload the pics to a web hosting site such as tinypic or photobucket, then post the URL on here, but change http to hxxp as Newbies can't post links or pics.

Half_way

edit, DO NOT UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCE INFORM THEM WHO WAS DRIVING

typhoon101

Thanks, I will post the windscreen ticket scan tonight. There are a lot of TLA's (Three Letter Abreviations) on the sticky that I don't understand... PPC, IPC, BPA, NTK to name a few. Hopefully the POPLA Decisions page will be clear. I will have a read

typhoon101

@Half_Way. Why shouldn't I tell them I was driving? Why is that so bad. In my appeal, I did use phrases like "I just parked in the space available between two cars" and "When I returned to my vehichle". Guess that amounts to the same thing

ManxRed

Private Parking Company
Independent Parking Committee
British Parking Association
Notice to Keeper

Only under certain conditions can they hold the registered keeper liable for the charge. Otherwise ONLY the driver can be held liable. As this is likely to be railway land, then the legislation allowing them to hold the registered keeper liable probably doesn't apply, so they can only pursue the driver.

The option of saying 'I'm the registered keeper, you need to take this up with the driver, who I am not legally obliged to name' has well and truly gone.

bod1467

If you read the NEWBIES thread it's actually pretty obvious why appeals should be made as the keeper, and to avoid "outing" yourself as the driver ... the Protection of Freedoms Act (POFA) 2012 Schedule 4 and the strict requirements it places for keeper liability to apply.

As it happens this is now a moot point - you already have outed yourself, so any POFA protection is gone.

And the TLAs are explained in a later post in the NEWBIES thread.

Coupon-mad

typhoon101 wrote: »

Thanks, I will post the windscreen ticket scan tonight. There are a lot of TLA's (Three Letter Abreviations) on the sticky that I don't understand... PPC, IPC, BPA, NTK to name a few. Hopefully the POPLA Decisions page will be clear. I will have a read

That's why it has a post to explain those abbreviations...:)

'POPLA Decisions' will confuse you; please don't read the old 2012 posts on it from page one!! Read some from the very last page of decisions and work your way back, you'll soon see the usual arguments which can win.

You've thrown away the easiest appeal point to win with at POPLA. So, start researching POPLA appeals to ensure you don't miss the other grounds for appeal which are NOT about 'the story of what happened'. NCP are so easy to beat at POPLA if you get the appeal right, such a shame you didn't read the sticky and use the template provided for the first appeal. Too late this time but ALWAYS appeal a private PCN as keeper, NEVER about what happened.

And no, I am not saying pay NCP (never!). Flipping easy to beat, just do the research this time, search the forum for 'NCP POPLA' for a start to find example POPLA appeals people have used but you are going to have to remove the entire appeal point sadly already chucked in the bin, about 'no keeper liability' and the PCN wording. You, as an admitted driver, can't use that appeal ground at all.