How much does a baby add to your budget?

zagfles

Person_one wrote: »

Do they? I thought 'deadbeat' was usually applied to dads who leave the family and then don't pay maintenance.

I've heard it applied to any man who doesn't do what society expects - ie bring home the bacon.

But just in terms of dads who leave the family and don't provide support - it's telling how they're almost always villified primarily for failing to provide financial support, rather than failing to provide care and parenting for the children.

Dad walks out on family. General reaction, OMG who will pay for the kids.

Mum walks out on family. General reaction, OMG who will look after the kids.

Stay at home dads are rare, but they don't seem to come in for a great deal of stick, certainly not the way working mums do!

Why do you think they're rare? Answer with no sexist stereotyping please

zagfles

duchy wrote: »

.
I know couples where both have continued to work and refused promotions or moved role to avoid needing to travel in their role or to have more scope to work partially from home. In all cases they worked for large corporations and HR were very cooperative in relocating them away from non family friendly roles

I do think attitudes are changing both with employers and employees and work life balance is more acknowledged .

I do however remember the week my son's entire nursery went down with chicken pox. My son had it mildly and wasn't sick but was technically infectious (he had 3 spots lol). I had no leave left and my husband did so he took holiday to be at home with him and I went to work. Some of my colleagues were shocked and openly critical that I'd come to work ....leaving him in the care of his father.

:eek: some people really need remining it's not 1950 any more!

When ours were young, we had a boss who'd let women have time off if their kids were ill, but if a man ever asked for the same, they'd always get "why can't your wife do it?"

Person_one

zagfles wrote: »

Mum walks out on family. General reaction, OMG who will look after the kids. Why do you think they're rare? Answer with no sexist stereotyping please

I think they're rare because they are rare!

http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/rel/lmac/families-in-the-labour-market/2014/rpt---families-in-the-labour-market.html#tab-Families-in-the-Labour-Market

Have a look at the table about halfway down titled "Families in employment by the number of employed parents, family type and age and number of dependent children, UK, April to June 2014" particularly the section that shows the gender breakdown of families where only one parent is in employment.

What makes you think they aren't rare? Answer honestly, with no desire to deny gender inequalities please!

duchy

.I remember when my husband and I split up -he assumed that I would be the one our son lived with fulltime and he would not need to help with childcare and would simply have the fun visits at weekends. When I suggested our son lived fifty fifty with each of us he was shocked that he wouldn't have the freedom to work late/socialize after work -and in general have a life and decided that it wouldn't be workable for him. I don't think his reaction is that uncommon.

Had he agreed we could have both had careers (rather than a career for him and a job for me)but the conditioning that the woman is still the one who has the lionshare of the day to day care even if she works . Schools will ring Mum at work before they think to ring Dad if a child needs to go home from school sick and employers in general tend to be more accepting of a Mum having to leave early if their child is ill than a Father. It may not be right but it's still how our society works- Change is slow.

It is pointless to demand "No sexist stereotyping" when our society is inherently sexist when it come to the division of parental roles.

If a couple splits up it is assumed Mum will get on with it and look after the kids...but if Dad is the PWC evetryone comments on how good he is to have the kids ....Double standard for sure !

zagfles wrote: »

I've heard it applied to any man who doesn't do what society expects - ie bring home the bacon.

But just in terms of dads who leave the family and don't provide support - it's telling how they're almost always villified primarily for failing to provide financial support, rather than failing to provide care and parenting for the children.

Dad walks out on family. General reaction, OMG who will pay for the kids.

Mum walks out on family. General reaction, OMG who will look after the kids. Why do you think they're rare? Answer with no sexist stereotyping please

zagfles

Person_one wrote: »

I think they're rare because they are rare!

http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/rel/lmac/families-in-the-labour-market/2014/rpt---families-in-the-labour-market.html#tab-Families-in-the-Labour-Market

Have a look at the table about halfway down titled "Families in employment by the number of employed parents, family type and age and number of dependent children, UK, April to June 2014" particularly the section that shows the gender breakdown of families where only one parent is in employment.

What makes you think they aren't rare? Answer honestly, with no desire to deny gender inequalities please!

Err...where have I disputed they are rare? I was asking you why they are rare.

I do know one of these rare breeds, but I'll let you answer first.

Alikay

zagfles wrote: »

Why do you think they're rare? Answer with no sexist stereotyping please

Well for starters, the woman is the one who is pregnant and gives birth, and therefore physically needs a certain amount of maternity leave. Breastfeeding is also something dad can't do, so those are the biological reasons Mums will usually stay home initially.

Once baby is born, and the initial post-partum period has passed, there's still the issue of family finances: It is still the case that the higher earner is more likely to be the man - not always the case, obv, but still likely. Male-dominated jobs like engineering and IT are in general better paid than female-dominated ones like nursing and childcare. If a female engineer with a male nursery-nurse partner has a baby, I think there's a pretty good chance he'll be the one to stay home to look after it.

zagfles

duchy wrote: »

.I remember when my husband and I split up -he assumed that I would be the one our son lived with fulltime and he would not need to help with childcare and would simply have the fun visits at weekends. When I suggested our son lived fifty fifty with each of us he was shocked that he wouldn't have the freedom to work late/socialize after work -and in general have a life and decided that it wouldn't be workable for him. I don't think his reaction is that uncommon.

Had he agreed we could have both had careers (rather than a career for him and a job for me)but the conditioning that the woman is still the one who has the lionshare of the day to day care even if she works . Schools will ring Mum at work before they think to ring Dad if a child needs to go home from school sick and employers in general tend to be more accepting of a Mum having to leave early if their child is ill than a Father. It may not be right but it's still how our society works- Change is slow.

It is pointless to demand "No sexist stereotyping" when our society is inherently sexist when it come to the division of parental roles.

Well, yes, that was the point I was driving at

If a couple splits up it is assumed Mum will get on with it and look after the kids...but if Dad is the PWC evetryone comments on how good he is to have the kids ....Double standard for sure !

Indeed. Equally, when a couple split, the mother often assumes that she'll get custody and the father will become the NRP, and it comes as a bit of a shock when the father decides to contest!

I think we're pretty much agreeing. For a change.

zagfles

Alikay wrote: »

Well for starters, the woman is the one who is pregnant and gives birth, and therefore physically needs a certain amount of maternity leave. Breastfeeding is also something dad can't do, so those are the biological reasons Mums will usually stay home initially.

Once baby is born, and the initial post-partum period has passed, there's still the issue of family finances: It is still the case that the higher earner is more likely to be the man - not always the case, obv, but still likely. Male-dominated jobs like engineering and IT are in general better paid than female-dominated ones like nursing and childcare. If a female engineer with a male nursery-nurse partner has a baby, I think there's a pretty good chance he'll be the one to stay home to look after it.

I think these are good reasons why they aren't in the majority, but not why they are as rare as they are. There are plenty of women who earn more than their partners, certainly more than the 3% or so the above stats showed. Maternity leave can now be shared - a few months off is unlikely to dent someone's career too much.

meer53

Might be just me but i always think people who use spreadsheets and the like to work out how much a baby will cost aren't really living in the real world. I'm not meaning to offend the OP, but a pen and a bit of paper usually does the job. Even then, the correct answer is "don't worry about the budget, just do it"

Babies don't cost much at all. Now teenagers, thats a whole new ballgame. By the time your child is a teenager, you're stuffed really, no spreadsheet in the world can prepare you for their demands. You just need to develop the ability to say "you are joking, aren't you ?" when the latest phone/tablet/games console/trainers/clothes come out.

I never once thought about how much it was going to cost. Because i knew that whatever happened, i would manage. I might not have the things i had before, but my children more than compensate for that.

Person_one

zagfles wrote: »

Err...where have I disputed they are rare? I was asking you why they are rare.

I do know one of these rare breeds, but I'll let you answer first.

Ah, I suppose you could read that question both ways! I'm used to people spouting anecdotal evidence that they know loads and loads of stay at home dads and they're all the victims of terrible schoolyard bullying by evil mum cliques!

They're obviously rare because we as a society still expect that women do the bulk of childcare, that they are the 'primary' parent, that being a mother should be the most important part of a woman's life and those assumptions permeate pretty much every part of our culture around work and families.

Why do you think they're rare then?