We need more of these

Mistermeaner

Graham_Devon wrote: »

Unless "it's what I think" is good enough now?

Only if you're correct, which they are.

Simple test - count number of staff in a tesco compared to an aldi then divide by number of aisles of similar. Bet ratios in aldi/lidl are lower.

chewmylegoff

Graham_Devon wrote: »

Yer, I mean, real evidence of the statements made.

Unless "it's what I think" is good enough now?

Have you ever shopped in aldi? If so, did you enjoy queuing for half an hour at the checkout? Whilst you were waiting in that queue, did you wonder why you never have to queue for more than a couple of minutes in tesco/sainsbury/Waitrose or whatever?

Then when you are trying to pack your aldi shopping and they start throwing the next person's shopping on top of yours before you can pack yours, do you delight in the customer service and remark how you are glad the cashier who is chucking some other harried customer's budget scones at you is paid £9 an hour and how this is just so much better than having more checkout staff paid a bit less.

Perhaps you do, but personally Ive got better things to do than stand in queues in aldi. they can pay their staff £100 a hour if they like and give away all their food for free, I'm still not going to shop there.

wotsthat

Graham_Devon wrote: »

Any evidence?

Anecdotally, having supplied Aldi / Lidl and actually opening my eyes when I go in Lidl. Have you been in one?

The model is designed to minimise employment of shelf stackers. A couple of examples; they're ruthless when it comes to shelf ready packaging and much of their stock is delivered on pallets which are simply wheeled out and ready to go - they even demand these pallets are delivered without stretch wrap which is a logistical difficulty, adds cost for suppliers but means Lidl staff don't even need to Waste time removing it.

When stuff does go on shelf you'll note there's less choice which speeds things up and you might note when they do add choice they often have, say, three varieties of something in the same selling unit. This means they get three varieties of whatever it is on shelf in a single movement with much less effort. These packs are also cost additive for supplier.

I'm probably being unfair comparing the average merchandiser from Tesco and Lidl. Lidl tend not to have them and are able to pay more to employ department supervisors instead who spend some time filling shelves but are more interested in sales than a typical shelf stacker might be.

In terms of checkout operators taking more cash it couldn't be more obvious. They have less checkouts so more cash goes through per person. You'll note the queues - this isn't because they're crap it's because they don't want checkout operators with any down time. Last thing they want is a checkout operator not scanning stuff but being paid. You must have seen when you get down the queue the stuff actually goes through like lightning, you won't be asked if you want help with packing and, if it's a big shop, there's no space to pack your bags so you've got to take your stuff away from the cash desk and pack it at the shelf by the window so they can get on with the next customer.

I don't know if it would surprise you but retailers actually know exactly how much each individual checkout operator scans. A guess but I'd say the average checkout operator in Lidl would probably be better than two thirds of their equivalent in Asda.

I think the discounters are great but you need to take me up on that thought experiment. If sales volumes stay the same in the UK but people shop in stores which have less staff per unit volume will employment in the sector go up or down?

Try this. Go to a Tesco and talk to the dedicated trolley collector, the checkout supervisor, shelf stacker, cleaning crew, store greeter, etc etc. then go to Lidl and have a chat with their equivalents. You might find them difficult to find but you could always ask at customer services

RichardD1970

My wife does a part time job at Aldi.

She was told when she applied that it would be hard work and there would be no standing around chatting to colleagues or sitting at empty checkouts (like you see in some other supermarkets) and everyone is expected to chip in if they are at a loose end.

Never had to queue for any great length of time, certainly no longer than in Asda et al and the packing system works well if everyone plays ball and doesn't try to pack at the checkout.

antrobus

wotsthat wrote: »

The Lidl model is to employ fewer people who are above average in their field and pay them above average wages for the job. ....

I'm not so sure about the "above average in their field" bit. I'd have put it a different way. As in willing to work that bit harder.

Which, if my local Lidl is anything to go by, boils down to employing eastern Europeans. (What kind, I don't know, because all Slavic languages sound the same to me.)

wotsthat wrote: »

...Of course the consumer will decide whether they're willing to pay the higher wages because I guarantee Lidl won't be funding this pay rise from their margin.

There is some evidence to suggest that paying people the LW as opposed to the NMW has tangible economic benefits.

KPMG has also found that the Living Wage simply makes good business sense. Since introducing the Living Wage for its staff in 2006, KPMG has found that the extra wage costs are more than met by lowered recruitment churn and absenteeism, greater loyalty, and higher morale leading to better performance. Turnover amongst KPMG’s contracted cleaning staff has more than halved since paying the Living Wage.

http://www.kpmg.com/uk/en/issuesandinsights/articlespublications/pages/living-wage.aspx

Graham_Devon

antrobus wrote: »

I'm not so sure about the "above average in their field" bit. I'd have put it a different way. As in willing to work that bit harder.

Agree with that.

And the upshot of that is, if people genuinely feel valued, which in a job is nearly always to do with pay, they will normally be willing to do a bit more.

There is nothing more demoralising than being on low pay.

whitegoods_engineer

Chewmylegoff stated that you have to wait for half an hour at Aldi and less at the established supermarkets.

Actually, I've found it to be the complete opposite.

The checkout operators go so fast scanning the goods, it is a job to get the stuff in the trolley. For this reason, the time between customers is very quick.

They don't mess about!

wotsthat

antrobus wrote: »

There is some evidence to suggest that paying people the LW as opposed to the NMW has tangible economic benefits.

I don't doubt there is. If you look at Lidl I expect that's partly because they earn more than they can get in comparable jobs at Tesco and the like and this reduces churn.

I suppose the question is whether people feel more valued because they get more than their peers or because they get a higher wage but that wage is the same as everyone else. I think more of the former.

If we take the OP at face value and assume we need more of the same and the living wage becomes the de facto minimum wage then everyone at Lidl will down tools and go and work at Tesco for the same money and more benefits and put their feet up.

If it's the living wage itself that leads to increased productivity and there's media and political pressure for others to follow suit then many companies will part fund this by reducing staff benefits. Lidl are ahead of the curve here because they didn't have any to talk of to start with.

Of course if everyone on minimum wage suddenly gets more productive by virtue of a pay rise then less workers will be needed.

kinger101

Graham_Devon wrote: »

Above average shelf stackers and checkout operators?

Anecdotal, I know, but the checkout operators in my local Aldi are much faster than you'll get in Tesco. And of course, their till layout means you don't get customers faffing at the other end.

You don't have to work at many places to realize that some of the employees are being carried by others. Where I work, I could sack 20% of people without it making any difference to output. I suspect this is true in many organizations.

Personally, I think it's great what Lidl are doing, and I approve of a living wage rather than the corporate welfare system of tax credits.