CRAs serve no good purpose. Their databases should be destroyed.

meer53

DandelionPatrol wrote: »

Minority, yes. On his own, NO.

You have a 1 dimensional view of their usefulness. Even if all the information is true, it is never entirely relevant. As OP's story shows, a bank will easily ignore 60 years of solid experience of a customer for the sake of some misguided tittle tattle about trousers worth £14.99.

It probably is not so much the CRAs as the idiocy of some organisations who interpret the info they hold.

I use CRA information as part of my job. My decisions are not purely based on this information, yes, they are part of the decision making process, but other factors are taken into account too.

Not all companies operate this way, i appreciate that, but making the CRA's out to be the bad boys is ridiculous. The CRA's don't apply defaults, the companies involved do. Anger should be vented towards the companies who are so narrow minded that their decisions are purely based on CRA information and nothing else.

DandelionPatrol

meer53 wrote: »

Anger should be vented towards the companies who are so narrow minded that their decisions are purely based on CRA information and nothing else.

I would not disagree. The only part that the CRA's play in this is [by their very existence] to encourage lazy thinking on the part of the companies using them.

Thrugelmir

GingerBob wrote: »

The dysfunctional CRA system fails eminently to identify those individuals who are real credit risks (Joe isn't such a person, though at one point he was).

There's ways of protecting oneself.

Then he lost his job/partner died/went bankrupt

It's called insurance. People have to be responsible for their own actions.

Johnnytwostep

the nutters are out tonight.I love it!!

agarnett

the nutters are out tonight.I love it!!

Love what, darlin' ?

I use CRA information as part of my job. My decisions are not purely based on this information, yes, they are part of the decision making process, but other factors are taken into account too.

Not all companies operate this way, i appreciate that, but making the CRA's out to be the bad boys is ridiculous. The CRA's don't apply defaults, the companies involved do. Anger should be vented towards the companies who are so narrow minded that their decisions are purely based on CRA information and nothing else.

Aw bless ... CRAs ... can't live with them when the other lot ("bad boys" - other banks and lenders??) do whatever they do versus whatever meer53 does, and trust the system because meer53 says he/she's been doing it a long time and can't see their way to being able to operate without CRA access as a prop to the job? Nah. I think we'll pass on that opinion - at least until meer53 tells us who those bad boys really are at whom we should vent the 'Anger' suggested. Is it just mail order companies one wonders? Or other banks ? But the CRAs shall remain blameless even though one at least started off as a mail order company spin off?

someone_else wrote:

There's ways of protecting oneself.

Then he lost his job/partner died/went bankrupt

It's called insurance. People have to be responsible for their own actions.

And the "insurance" you allude to is sold how and by whom and at what fair rate and how do you qualify and what is excluded? Bankruptcy cover for the masses too? Even if you know even some of the answers, are you really suggesting that there are insurance products suitable for all the ages/incomes/working patterns/non-working patterns typical of the UK labour force? I can tell you that you are recommending some supposed thing which actually does not exist for anything more than a minority, and for rather fewer insured events than I think you have incorrectly implied already. Furthermore, that minority has very little crossover with the much larger group regularly stymied and permanently stuffed by the existence of CRAs simply because of pure bad luck.

You must forgive me when I say that to me (someone who knows rather a lot about that of which I am typing) when you make such a simplistic assertion, you sound almost like just another ignorant bank staff seller or lead generator from the absolutely disgraceful bad old days of mandatory PPI selling. Those were the days when it was basically a standing instruction to be heeded by everyone in a bank branch.

Where are those ignorant bank staff dirty workers now I wonder? Still around unfortunately, still taking the shilling without question, pretending PPI was nothing to do with them and that it was just their job. Need a more challenging new product to sell, do they? Train them via CBT during their lunchbreaks and let the computer mark their test results after they've sat in huddles helping each other choose the right answers to be certified as "compliant sellers"?

And now you really do want them to sell full income protection to all comers? What should it cost? Any ideas? And for how long should it pay a full income replacement benefit? SHall it be an advised IPP or a non-advised PHI or what do you suggest? And what limits would there be on this protection to make sure it it isn't seen as too useful by those that might even understand the product they have bought?

And here's thought - should Experian, Equifax and Call Credit and LexisNexis and the NHunter Database and goodness knows who else be tolerated to keep tabs on who has bought such insurance and whether they are up to date with the payments (assuming it isn't single premium in advance again loaned to the customer under a credit agreement in which case it'd show up anyway, rightaway, would it not :rotfl:)

Yes there are always means of protecting oneself if you are the clever !!!!!! like you, or like me.

But then I am not posting here in an effort to protect you or me, now am I? Question is, why are you posting here?

harryfrombarry_2

agarnett wrote: »

Died in the wool bank staff.

Forgive them Lord, for they know not what they do half the time, and could care less the other half.


Anyway, back to the main theme of the uselessness and dangers inherent in propounding the UK's love affair with CRAs:

Today my internet-less aged parents received an Experian Alert via email.

If they knew what email was all about AND they knew how to view it on their mobile phone then of course we couldn't say they were strictly internet-less could we? However, it is generally accepted that less than 1/3rd of those age 75+ are connected at home.

OK so the rest of our most senior citizens may be clueless with regard to the technological revolutions of the last two decades, other than one or two medical ones of course! They are clueless to common trickery devised in the last two decades to take advantage of the technological revolutions which into which they have been involuntarily sucked. So they know about being wary of strangers knocking at the door, but they are unaware that businesses like Thrugelmir's take shortcuts with "know your customer" and in fact couldn't give a toss who is buying their cheap trousers on appo from a classified ad in the Daily Express because as a "business" (any old business will do) they have purchased the power from a CRA to play God, dreamed up a non-existent credit agreement that fits the CRA's definition of "mail order credit" even though no-one asked for credit, and hey presto, they gaily and daily slap black marks over pensioners credit files for those who are a bit slow on the uptake.

Of course many of the smart Alecs on these forums smirk at the ridiculousness of those who are not connected or whose hands are not being held by dominant offspring towards financial and technological righteousness.

To them I say, you should be ashamed, both at your blinkered, and at your unkind view of those who share our pale blue dot.

88% of pensioners in the UK record their religious affiliation as Christian. 8% are recorded as of no religion. Can we please be a bit more Christian in outlook when considering their plight such that they might maintain their faith in human kindness at least? Many come to this particular forum complain about CRAs, but most of the elderly cannot. The treatment some of our senior citizens receive at the hands of CRAs and profiteers goes endured silently and despairingly. This must stop.


So what was this credit file alert my parents received from Experian today which they were being urged to log in and check out?

Turns out it was the credit search by the bank ten days ago ... remember that? The one that resulted in the bank saying no new debit card, you'll have to subscribe to Experian, Equifax or Callcredit to find out why?

And what did we do? Yep we immediately set about subscribing and the Experian account was set up 9 days ago. I activated it on 31st with the PIN code and saw everything including the bank search and two by Experian itself. And they know we logged in and saw it.

But today we needed to urgently log in to see what they know we already saw?

Useless bloody "service" - for a potential £14.99 per month before I knock it on the head out of its misery, you'd have thought something a bit more instant was proper. Afterall, they give instant access to our personal data to any other party who pays ...

Nope, the UK CRA system is a big wrong. It doesn't have to be this way. Those who blandly say it does without making any suggestion for reform whatsoever are very obviously blinkered. With some horses blinkers are necessary to keep them focused on winning the race. With the best good natured favorites not so edgy with the world and jumpy in their own skin, blinkers aren't necessary either for high performance, or for being safely presented to owners and punters in the paddock.

Mate, you sound REALLY weird.

GingerBob_3

harryfrombarry wrote: »

Mate, you sound REALLY weird.

There's something you need to understand when "contributing" to forums such as these:


Comment on the content, not on the contributor.


You might vehemently disagree with a particular view, and if you do, you are quite free to put forward an opposing view, but don't harangue the person with the view that you object to.


If you can't come up with a sensible opposing argument then perhaps you should move on elsewhere.

andyfromotley

I agree with Ginger Bob that the scope of CRA's need curtailing. I think they are ripe for effective and thorough regulation.

Chances of this happening... about zero.

harryfrombarry_2

GingerBob wrote: »

There's something you need to understand when "contributing" to forums such as these:


Comment on the content, not on the contributor.


You might vehemently disagree with a particular view, and if you do, you are quite free to put forward an opposing view, but don't harangue the person with the view that you object to.


If you can't come up with a sensible opposing argument then perhaps you should move on elsewhere.

Nothing a bit of testicular fortitude can't remedy.

agarnett

Why do I never cease to be amazed at the lost souls roaming the internet just itching to find a space to type their favorite bit of urban slang trying to look clever? If it was used in proper context it might raise a smile, but just a random use of such a phrase is totally pointless isn't it?

Meanwhile I am still daily collecting ridiculous experiences courtesy of pointless CRA and bank computer programs which are also out of control and out of their supposed intended context. Maybe I shall be able to relate a few when I have sorted them all out.

Actually here's one I can share - my latest - a reversal of a decision to suddenly reduce a credit card limit of 15 years standing of £10,000 down to £500 because a DD failed. Fair enough! I am sure many died in the wool bank staff might instantly cry!

Well they are the ones who wouldn't look further than the fact of the DD failure, into the 'why', are they not?

So I got the decision reversed without any written appeal, just a proper phone conversation with someone authorised to listen and to note what the computer did or did not do with regard to Late Payments and penalty charges and CRA reports, and who was equipped with the necessary resources to go away and get a proper decision within half an hour.

So refreshing that it is sometimes still possible to cut through the CRAp!