Bit shocked

zagubov

Generali wrote: »

The UK does have a very successful manufacturing sector. What it doesn't do any longer is dangerous and polluting metal bashing work thankfully. What it does do is high value adding specialised production.

I appreciate that. We've obviously arranged our economy to keep obvious unemployment at a low rate, but I worry that it's unbalanced and needs more building things that use our expertise.

When I walked along the Thames last Saturday I could see tons of new housing, but it didn't seem inhabited. We're kidding ourselves that construction in London is accommodating its workforce.

Instead they're having a long commute at high environmental cost and massive extensions to the working day.

We're effectively building acres of showhomes without occupants while everyone else is squeezed into smaller spaces.

cells

lisyloo wrote: »

Not sure if you live in London mistermeaner, but many junctions are too busy for you to jump the lights as a pedestrian and have long waits.
My walking speed is average.
i use walkit.com which gives 3 times - fast, medium and slow.
i'm average height and I find the medium which is about 3 miles per hour is about right for central London where there are lots of waits and sometimes foot traffic slowing you down.

I do 4 miles on the bike as I actually go out of London and come back in again. That might sound bit weird but places like charring chross are very very busy and I prefer to cycle on the backstreets.
I certainly feel much nicer in the summer after a shower and I do sweat where my back pack is. I have dainty wet patches compared with my male colleagues but nevertheless I feel a lot better after a shower in the summer.

A lot of time to be honest I really don't feel up to cycling so it's certainly not going to be an option for me every day throughout the winter. This week for example I've had a cold so I've been under the weather. Next Thursday I'm going to the rugby and Friday I'll have luggage. No way can I cycle every day.

Electric bicycle?

cells

zagubov wrote: »

I appreciate that. We've obviously arranged our economy to keep obvious unemployment at a low rate, but I worry that it's unbalanced and needs more building things that use our expertise.

When I walked along the Thames last Saturday I could see tons of new housing, but it didn't seem inhabited. We're kidding ourselves that construction in London is accommodating its workforce.

Instead they're having a long commute at high environmental cost and massive extensions to the working day.

We're effectively building acres of showhomes without occupants while everyone else is squeezed into smaller spaces.

There is no easy way to know if a block is empty or full by looking at lights on.

Last time in was in London i tried to pay attention to the proportion of lights that were on in building's and what i found was that the majority of lights were off

Specifically one thing I noticed was that for the council blocks vary few lights were on (majority of flats in that area are council) as a guess 15% were on

My initial thought was !!!!!! are these council properties empty but within a few seconds its easy to come to the conclusion that people don't purposefully leave lights on so street observers can guesstimate occupancy levels. The councils blocks were v.likely >95% full but only 15% of the blocks lights are on in the direction fronting the road I was viewing

Try it next time your out and about then council blocks are obvious see hownmany of the lights are on

cells

Generali wrote: »

The UK does have a very successful manufacturing sector. What it doesn't do any longer is dangerous and polluting metal bashing work thankfully. What it does do is high value adding specialised production.

We have a significant 'metal basing' manufacturing base. The so-called low value stuff is a measure of value per kg and has no significant meaning by itself

Also without the low value stuff how are you going to make the high value stuff. For example how possible do you think it would be for the UK to manufacture cars if we didn't manufactured steel and steel products?

And finally manufacturing is far more diverse and includes things people wouldn't naturally think of as manufacturing. Eg food manufacturing is perhaps the biggest manufacturing sector in any nation and perhaps even in the world. A £3 pack of cornflakes is maybe 20p of ingredients £1 of retail and £1.80 of manufacturing. Food manufacturing is probably why all the rich nations also seem on paper big manufacturers.

zagubov

cells wrote: »

We have a significant 'metal basing' manufacturing base. The so-called low value stuff is a measure of value per kg and has no significant meaning by itself

Also without the low value stuff how are you going to make the high value stuff. For example how possible do you think it would be for the UK to manufacture cars if we didn't manufactured steel and steel products?

And finally manufacturing is far more diverse and includes things people wouldn't naturally think of as manufacturing. Eg food manufacturing is perhaps the biggest manufacturing sector in any nation and perhaps even in the world. A £3 pack of cornflakes is maybe 20p of ingredients £1 of retail and £1.80 of manufacturing. Food manufacturing is probably why all the rich nations also seem on paper big manufacturers.

Many countries whose economies and geography don't make agriculture easy still devote a lot of land to agriculture and a lot of industry to food production. Even Japan and Taiwan do that, It's just seen as strategic suicide for a country to give up food production. I don't blame them either.

cells

cells wrote: »

We have a significant 'metal basing' manufacturing base. The so-called low value stuff is a measure of value per kg and has no significant meaning by itself

Also without the low value stuff how are you going to make the high value stuff. For example how possible do you think it would be for the UK to manufacture cars if we didn't manufactured steel and steel products?

And finally manufacturing is far more diverse and includes things people wouldn't naturally think of as manufacturing. Eg food manufacturing is perhaps the biggest manufacturing sector in any nation and perhaps even in the world. A £3 pack of cornflakes is maybe 20p of ingredients £1 of retail and £1.80 of manufacturing. Food manufacturing is probably why all the rich nations also seem on paper big manufacturers.

I wonder what proportion of manufacturing is this type of local 'low value' manufacturing

Food beverage and tabaco manufacturing
Construction materials manufacturing
Electricity manufacturing
Printing (magazines newspapers etc)
Refining oil
Etc

My guess is more than half

Generali

zagubov wrote: »

I appreciate that. We've obviously arranged our economy to keep obvious unemployment at a low rate, but I worry that it's unbalanced and needs more building things that use our expertise.

When I walked along the Thames last Saturday I could see tons of new housing, but it didn't seem inhabited. We're kidding ourselves that construction in London is accommodating its workforce.

Instead they're having a long commute at high environmental cost and massive extensions to the working day.

We're effectively building acres of showhomes without occupants while everyone else is squeezed into smaller spaces.

TBH I don't buy this 'unbalanced' argument. The UK is the 6th biggest manufacturer in the world despite being the 78th biggest country and having the 22nd largest population (thanks Wikipedia).

The UK is also the second biggest exporter of services in the world.

House prices are expensive because of bad politics not because of economics.

gadgetmind

michaels wrote: »

all the imports we wouldn't be able to afford if we didn't sell stuff to foreigners.

Of course, quite a lot of these imports have significant elements designed in the UK, including the iPhone. I'd much rather the UK generated income by designing things rather than sitting back and hoping that HPI will go on forever.

gadgetmind

lisyloo wrote: »

No way can I cycle every day.

I do as it's 3x faster than any other mode of transport on my commute. I currently have an injury that's preventing me cycling, and its' making life complicated and unpleasant. I miss my bike.

C_Mababejive

I am unclear as to what is so special about London.. True many people live there because it is the area of their birth, where they grew up. They live there because that is where their work is. If it is so expensive, how is it that so many migrants can live there? Surely they are being exploited and working in the back economy to feed the profits of others higher up the food chain who leech off them?

London is just another city ,another town with buildings, infrastructure, people ,houses,,, It is as much a myth as the estate agents want it to be. Just another jungle where the strong prey on and exploit the week for betterment and profit. And wy shouldnt it be so with so many willing volunteers rushing to take their place in the galleys of the good ship HMS London.