Middle Lane Hogging - North/South divide..

NBLondon

dktreesea wrote: »

It isn't so much that. I drive on motorways that are pretty much chocka, even in the middle of the day. With trucks not only in the leftmost lane, but also the middle lane.

Look - this is the key point...


When Lane 1 is busy with only small gaps between vehicles, it is reasonable to be in Lane 2 for long periods if you are overtaking those vehicles. Nobody (no reasonable driver) expects you to dive in again for 10 seconds. But if you are staying out so long that a vehicle cruising in an empty Lane 1 can catch up to you and possibly pass on the left - you should have moved in well before that.


If you are in Lane 2 just because you don't like lorries - you possibly need some more training. If you are in Lane 2 at 57mph to overtake a HGV doing 56 - you possibly need some more training.


If you are approaching an exit in Lane 1 and people are slowing to turn off; then move to Lane 2 if it is safe and overtake them. No need to move out 2 miles ahead just in case someone might do that.


If you are approaching an entry in Lane 1 and can see vehicles on the slip road; it is their responsibility to join safely. If you want to be courteous and move to Lane 2 to help them - you only do this when safe and without being discourteous to those already in Lane 2 overtaking you. If there is no-one on the slip road, stay where you are.


Somebody above mentioned the A2 as an example of a 3 lane dual carriageway where Lane 1 often becomes an exit lane. I drive it fairly often and I agree that when it's busy, you do end up cruising in Lane 2 as there isn't enough space to move back into Lane 1 for the short stretches where it's a normal lane.


As to the original question.... I haven't noticed a geographical variation - although it's been a few years since I drove the M62 etc.


The 4-lane segments of the M25 sometimes end up with the double-CLOC ... One in Lane 2 at 62 and one in Lane 3 at 65. Even when I'm approaching them in Lane 1 with the cruise control at 72... I can only assume that some people have got a fixed idea that Lane 1 is for HGVs - even when there isn't one within 3 miles.

Joe_Horner

IanMSpencer wrote: »

The truck problem is a classic. [...]
There is nothing wrong with deciding not to pass, but why sit in the middle lane when the inside lane is equally a good place to wait?

Totally agree with everything in that but would like to offer the following possible answer to your question at the end:

More often than not when it's busy enough fr this to matter, you'll find the lh lane filled with lorries who seem to be happy following each other with about 1 car length in between. Try to slot in there and there's a good chance they won't even see you as they roll over you.

Regardless of whether that suggestion is the reason or not, the fact still remains that everyone (including the HGVs!) leaving (properly) appropriate gaps is the one thing that would drastically improve traffic flow for everybody on the roads.

Despite popular beliefs, a road with traffic spaced well enough to prevent sudden reactions will carry more traffic at a higher average speed than having all the cars up each other's arrses.

dktreesea

jase1 wrote: »

Hmmm. The A19 you say? I drive, erm, enthusiastically and even I tend to take care on that road, far too many junctions (on the left and right), many of them blind to be pushing it too hard on that road.

Yes, it seems to be the alternative to the A1 going north, to avoid the speed restrictions around Gateshead and Newcastle. I thought trucks were meant to stick to below 60mph on A roads, but apparently not from what I saw.

dktreesea

IanMSpencer wrote: »

The truck problem is a classic. For a start, a fair number do not "make progress" happy to block a lane for literally miles (my record was 10 miles on the M42 two lane, following a snail race).

Then if you have truck passing truck you get a long tail of cars sitting in the middle lane who apparently have no intention of risking life and limb in the 3rd lane but on the other hand are not interested in sitting in the 1st lane. You can have a tail of 15 cars to pass, none of whom even consider pulling out, so then you have an even longer tail in the 3rd lane.

If the middle lane, not interested in going anywhere bods tidied up their space and kept left as they are not going anywhere slower, the tail would be out of the way, and the overtaking queue could be shortened too as they are only passing one lorry, not one lorry and 20 cars so there is only a short length of "single lane".

There is nothing wrong with deciding not to pass, but why sit in the middle lane when the inside lane is equally a good place to wait?

Because there are trucks behind you and in front of you, everyone is travelling too close, and now there is one next to you, trying to overtake, but taking his time about it, the truck in front of you. And just ahead a junction is looming, but you can't move to the right to let the joining traffic onto the motorway. All too dangerous. Yes, I can understand why cars stick to the middle lane and let the trucks take over the left lane.

I also suspect that a lot of the cars on the road, unlike the trucks, may not be particularly familiar with the stretch of motorway they are on. I notice that on the M25. People who are obviously not familiar with its quirks, like how the right lane sometimes is the one that disappears.


If everyone is driving at the limit (so no need for anyone to overtake them) and are all driving in the left lane, then how can this be an efficient use of a three lane motorway?

Zandoni

dktreesea wrote: »

Because there are trucks behind you and in front of you, everyone is travelling too close, and now there is one next to you, trying to overtake, but taking his time about it, the truck in front of you. And just ahead a junction is looming, but you can't move to the right to let the joining traffic onto the motorway. All too dangerous. Yes, I can understand why cars stick to the middle lane and let the trucks take over the left lane.


The car joining the motorway should match the speed and join safely.

I also suspect that a lot of the cars on the road, unlike the trucks, may not be particularly familiar with the stretch of motorway they are on. I notice that on the M25. People who are obviously not familiar with its quirks, like how the right lane sometimes is the one that disappears.


Where does that happen on the M25?


If everyone is driving at the limit (so no need for anyone to overtake them) and are all driving in the left lane, then how can this be an efficient use of a three lane motorway?


Everyone driving at the limit never happens on a motorway

You must also realise you have to drive to the law not your impression of it.

NBLondon

dktreesea wrote: »

If everyone is driving at the limit (so no need for anyone to overtake them) and are all driving in the left lane, then how can this be an efficient use of a three lane motorway?

There are different limits for different types of vehicle y'know. So overtaking will sometimes be required.


If you're unfamiliar with the road; then following the highway code and the road signs is the thing to do. (OK - we all know there are some bad road designs out there). But the right lane doesn't disappear (in a puff of purple smoke?) there will be signs telling drivers to merge.


What you're apparently saying is that because some drivers drive badly (trucks driving closer, people joining unsafely) others then drive badly as an act of self-preservation which then becomes a habit rather than driving better themselves. Is that what you mean?

Tilt

dktreesea wrote: »

Because there are trucks behind you and in front of you, everyone is travelling too close, and now there is one next to you, trying to overtake, but taking his time about it, the truck in front of you. And just ahead a junction is looming, but you can't move to the right to let the joining traffic onto the motorway. All too dangerous. Yes, I can understand why cars stick to the middle lane and let the trucks take over the left lane.

You portray it like lane 1 is constantly nose to tail with trucks when obviously it isn't. The issue is how the middle lane is used (or hogged) by cars when lane 1 is clear.

dktreesea wrote: »

I also suspect that a lot of the cars on the road, unlike the trucks, may not be particularly familiar with the stretch of motorway they are on. I notice that on the M25. People who are obviously not familiar with its quirks, like how the right lane sometimes is the one that disappears.

I use the M25 quite often and there are a number of sections that have 4 running lanes. Lane 1 is usually the one that 'disappears' when it becomes an off slip.

dktreesea wrote: »

If everyone is driving at the limit (so no need for anyone to overtake them) and are all driving in the left lane, then how can this be an efficient use of a three lane motorway?

I have to say this is quite a ridiculous comment and obviously from someone with very little knowledge of driving.

For a start there are different classes of vehicles which have different speed limits. Cars (for example) can do 70 mph but not when they are pulling a caravan or trailer when they can only do 60mph. HGVs are limited to lanes 1 and 2 and can only do 60mph.
Coaches up to 12 mtrs in length can do 70 BUT can only use lane 1 and 2.

So where is your logic in "no need for anyone to overtake"? Quite frankly your seem to be condoning hogging the middle lane (which basically reduces a 3 lane motorway into a 2 lane one) which suggests to me that you are an incompetent driver.

almillar

Because there are trucks behind you and in front of you, everyone is travelling too close, and now there is one next to you, trying to overtake, but taking his time about it, the truck in front of you. And just ahead a junction is looming, but you can't move to the right to let the joining traffic onto the motorway. All too dangerous. Yes, I can understand why cars stick to the middle lane and let the trucks take over the left lane.

Sounds like you're not very good at motorway or dual carraigeway driving. If you drive at the speed limit in your car (probably 70), then you shouldn't find yourself stuck between 2 trucks with one bearing down on you. Staying in the middle lane, when there's nothing to the left of you, is simply selfish and/or lazy.

dannyrst

The problem is education. (oh dear, I sound like an MP)

But really. The way the roads are used changes over time. Cars are faster, safer and there are more of them on the roads.

We test people aged 17 how to drive and then let them go forever more without checking up on them for driving ability.

colin13

on m6 going to blackpool,,a police car on inside lane,,we overtook it and pulled into inside lane,,it was funny watching everone do it,,,a minute later all back to normall