Energy company withdrawing money after switch?

Cavalli12

I'm the carer and attorney for my elderly mother and so look after her bills and finances. We've had gas and electricity supplied by Npower for a year or two, paid for by monthly direct debit, and when the existing tarrif came to an end in May used comparison sites to switch to Extraenergy . The transfer went ahead in May. However I now find that Npower have withdrawn an astonishing £658 from my mother's bank account on 3 July before closing the account!

For the time being I've contacted them through the form on their website (from experience, if I do so by phone I will need to go through the rigmarole of sending off copies of the power of attorney before they would even speak to me, taking more days or weeks before I get to the bottom of it). While I await a reply does anyone here have a similar experience or can suggest if there's any way this withdrawal of such an amount could possibly be legitimate? Bills were estimated with occassional meter readings and there has never been any correspondence suggesting failures to pay. So how can she/we have been in debt to them by what seems like half a year's worth of energy?!

modsandmockers

Cavalli12 wrote: »

I'm the carer and attorney for my elderly mother and so look after her bills and finances. We've had gas and electricity supplied by Npower for a year or two, paid for by monthly direct debit, and when the existing tarrif came to an end in May used comparison sites to switch to Extraenergy . The transfer went ahead in May. However I now find that Npower have withdrawn an astonishing £658 from my mother's bank account on 3 July before closing the account!

For the time being I've contacted them through the form on their website (from experience, if I do so by phone I will need to go through the rigmarole of sending off copies of the power of attorney before they would even speak to me, taking more days or weeks before I get to the bottom of it). While I await a reply does anyone here have a similar experience or can suggest if there's any way this withdrawal of such an amount could possibly be legitimate? Bills were estimated with occassional meter readings and there has never been any correspondence suggesting failures to pay. So how can she/we have been in debt to them by what seems like half a year's worth of energy?!

The unexpected debit is covered by the direct debit guarantee. You clearly disagree with the debit, and were not notified in advance of Npower's intention to take the money, so just call the bank (assuming they already recognise you as your mother's authorised representative) and reclaim the payment under the direct debit guarantee. If Npower try to pick a fight, then you will obviously have to satisfy them that you are authorised to speak on your mother's behalf. Good luck!

Cavalli12

Well this is the thing.. I'd feel a lot more confident disagreeing with it if I understood it! It's certainly unexpected but energy tarriffs being generally incomprehensible I'm trying to establish whether I'm simply being obtuse and missing something..and perhaps this large build up of debt is normal in some way.

What I'll do is try later this evening and retrieve all of the monthly statements for the last year and see if it becomes apparent to anyone here if not to my self what I may be missing.

In the words of Arnie.. I'll be back.

modsandmockers

Cavalli12 wrote: »

Well this is the thing.. I'd feel a lot more confident disagreeing with it if I understood it! It's certainly unexpected but energy tarriffs being generally incomprehensible I'm trying to establish whether I'm simply being obtuse and missing something..and perhaps this large build up of debt is normal in some way.

What I'll do is try later this evening and retrieve all of the monthly statements for the last year and see if it becomes apparent to anyone here if not to my self what I may be missing.

In the words of Arnie.. I'll be back.

The struggle to understand the mysterious methods of the energy industry is widespread and entirely understandable to everybody except the energy industry itself. But the direct debit guarantee is crystal clear - you are under no obligation to allow Npower to hold on to your mother's money until you are satisfied that there is good reason. The first thing to do is to call the bank and get the money back.

Ideally, you will have a record of all meter readings, bills, and changing prices over at least the last year or two. If you can find a reliable point in time to start from, you should then be able to calculate your mother's actual energy costs, and the total of payments made, over the period in question. The difference between the two figures will show you who is owed money by whom.

lvf

It is standard practice to withdraw the final debit balance in full when the account closes.

I'm guessing nPower have calculated the final bill to be this amount.

Is the final bill amount correct? Have you verified this by checking the meter readings used?

Cavalli12

Well I've checked both paper bank statements and logged on to the Npower website account to get a history of bills and payments.

In broad terms its clear that teh money taken out of the bank over the course of one year, prior to this dramatic withdrawal, is improbably low. About £50 per month or 600 total from march til march. Taking £1200 to be unexceptional for annual energy costs, I assume they have been in effect or appearance undercharging in terms of hte money they were taking out by 50% more or less and now claiming the rest. I don't understand why they would do so or if its normal practice or not.

I say in broad terms as I have the "account activity" in front of me and can't make head nor tail of how it works. eg
10sept 2014 "your bill -£437.73," then each month from september through to march it has
"payment - £54" then on 13 March - "your bill - £678." followed by payments of £114 and £158 in April and May and then again in may "your Bill - £184" followed by a july payment of £658!

I'm completely lost on that.. do the bills refer to the past or the future? and how to do the last few bills and payments add up?

Taiko

There's also the added problem that it's NPower!

Certainly double check the readings though. Wouldn't surprise me if they'd made a mistake.

lvf

Bills refer to what has already been used in the property. A bill is a point in time where your account pays for the energy used to that day. That is why there are meter reads required for a bill, to get an accurate measurement of the use in the property instead of them having to take a guess at it.

You should be able to calculate yourself if their amount is correct. Open each bill, check the meter reads on each bill and multiply by the tariff prices, adding in any standing charges, removing any discounts if applicable and then adding your 5% VAT on top.

I'm not saying nPower are right or wrong, because we all know of their recent billing saga, but you need a little more than "it can't be right, it's too high, i don't know how but it must be wrong." Find if there is a mistake then press on with a complaint if there is one.

Cardew

The first thing to establish is if the final meter readings for the NPower Account are the same as the start meter readings for Extra Energy. If they are you have an established base to start checking the Npower account.


You(your mother) must be notified of the intent to debit her account by £658. This is often at the bottom of a bill amongst the small print and not noticed by the customer.


It doesn't sound as if the 'your bill' sums of £437.73, £678, and £184 are outstanding amounts carrying forward the previous balance, as it is difficult to see how the bill reduced from £678 to £184 unless the £678 was based on an over-estimated meter reading; denoted by an 'E'.

footyguy

Cavalli12 wrote: »

I'm the carer and attorney for my elderly mother and so look after her bills and finances. We've had gas and electricity supplied by Npower for a year or two, paid for by monthly direct debit, and when the existing tarrif came to an end in May used comparison sites to switch to Extraenergy . The transfer went ahead in May. However I now find that Npower have withdrawn an astonishing £658 from my mother's bank account on 3 July before closing the account!

For the time being I've contacted them through the form on their website (from experience, if I do so by phone I will need to go through the rigmarole of sending off copies of the power of attorney before they would even speak to me, taking more days or weeks before I get to the bottom of it). While I await a reply does anyone here have a similar experience or can suggest if there's any way this withdrawal of such an amount could possibly be legitimate? Bills were estimated with occassional meter readings and there has never been any correspondence suggesting failures to pay. So how can she/we have been in debt to them by what seems like half a year's worth of energy?!

Cavalli12 wrote: »

Well this is the thing.. I'd feel a lot more confident disagreeing with it if I understood it! It's certainly unexpected but energy tarriffs being generally incomprehensible I'm trying to establish whether I'm simply being obtuse and missing something..and perhaps this large build up of debt is normal in some way.

What I'll do is try later this evening and retrieve all of the monthly statements for the last year and see if it becomes apparent to anyone here if not to my self what I may be missing.

In the words of Arnie.. I'll be back.

So were you given advance notice of the intended DD deduction or not?

If so, I'm not sure why you were astonished when the supplier did what they earlier informed you they would do. :huh:

If not, as stated, claim a full and immediate refund from your bank under the terms of the DD guarantee.
You don't need to understand any bill. Reason for claim: No Advance Notice given.

Simples! :cool:

footyguy

Cavalli12 wrote: »

Well I've checked both paper bank statements and logged on to the Npower website account to get a history of bills and payments.

In broad terms its clear that teh money taken out of the bank over the course of one year, prior to this dramatic withdrawal, is improbably low. About £50 per month or 600 total from march til march. Taking £1200 to be unexceptional for annual energy costs, I assume they have been in effect or appearance undercharging in terms of hte money they were taking out by 50% more or less and now claiming the rest. I don't understand why they would do so or if its normal practice or not.

I say in broad terms as I have the "account activity" in front of me and can't make head nor tail of how it works. eg
10sept 2014 "your bill -£437.73," then each month from september through to march it has
"payment - £54" then on 13 March - "your bill - £678." followed by payments of £114 and £158 in April and May and then again in may "your Bill - £184" followed by a july payment of £658!

I'm completely lost on that.. do the bills refer to the past or the future? and how to do the last few bills and payments add up?

Post a legible image of the final bill here (remove personal information, serial numbers, account numbers etc) and someone will explain it to you.

Or take it along to the CAB and they will explain it for you.

(Although a final bill shouldn't be particularly different from a mid-term bill/statement in it's appearence - specific values will of course differ)


Edit: Or try this link
https://www.npower.com/home/help-and-support/bills-and-payments/your-bill-explained/

Video doesn't seem to work, but the words alone explain it.
You may get offered online chat support too if you still need it.