UKPC - PCN for Not Parking in Bay

Diverdave

Hi, I am a newbie here and have read the newbie section, but I don't see this mentioned so would like some quick clarification.

I parked in a customers car park on Monday (6/7/15) and as they had no allocated spaces left, I parked next to one of their spaces but wasn't parked in a marked bay. My car was by no means causing any obstruction whatsoever (I have taken several photos) and I had placed a business card on my windscreen of the client I was going to visit.

I was at the customers for all of five minutes when returning to my car, the parking attendant was placing a PCN onto my windscreen. He had done me for not parking in a marked bay as shown on the signage in the car park.

So my question, as I hadn't parked in accordance to their sign, can I still fight this and expect to win? If so, I just follow the newbie guide and appeal on Day 20?

Thanks in advance.

PS: I have been trying to get the customer to get the ticket cancelled by the landlord, but she has had no response as yet.

bazster

Yes you can fight and win. The day 20 malarkey isn't really applicable to UKPC, just wait until you get a Notice in the post (you might've got it cancelled by then anyway).

Diverdave

bazster wrote: »

Yes you can fight and win. The day 20 malarkey isn't really applicable to UKPC, just wait until you get a Notice in the post (you might've got it cancelled by then anyway).

Thanks. Just want to make sure I get this right as I really think its unfair. Will keep you posted on the progress!

Diverdave

Hello, I realise the newbie section is full of good advice but I find it all a little daunting and confusing, there is a lot of information to take in. I am just after a bit of re-assurance in getting my PCN cancelled as I have read the following on the Popla website.

The grounds on which you may make representations are:

• The vehicle was not improperly parked;
• The vehicle was stolen;
• The parking charge (ticket) exceeded the appropriate amount;
• I am not liable for the parking charge.

As mentioned, I wasn't parked in a bay so can I really fight this with a good chance of winning? Whilst £60 is extortinate, I really cant afford to pay £100. Also, I notice in the newbie section that I should wait 3 weeks before appealing, but Bazster above states that this isn't required when appealing to UKPC, why is that?


I'm not sure if this makes a difference, I drive a company car but the car is not leased or hired and I have informed the fleet manager of the PCN and told him to pass any letters regarding it to myself.


Thanks in advance.

Redx

as you are the hirer (keeper) of the vehicle, send the template letter to UKPC after day 21 , but by day 25 , appealing as KEEPER

dont alter it , DO NOT ADMIT WHO WAS DRIVING EITHER

add the pcn ref number , your name and a serviceable postal address as well

wait for a rejection and a popla code (or a cancellation)

with popla, you will tick all the boxes except stolen, then you will submit a legal argument appeal based on

no contract
poor signage
not a gpeol (plus the Beavis wording that is in blue)

anything else that is relevant

it will be similar to this one

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5248470

Diverdave

Thanks Redx, you must get fed up with people like me! One other question, how can you claim poor signage when there was signage there? I wasn't parked next to it but I noticed the parking attendant taking a photo of it after he did me!

Redx

Diverdave wrote: »

Thanks Redx, you must get fed up with people like me! One other question, how can you claim poor signage when there was signage there? I wasn't parked next to it but I noticed the parking attendant taking a photo of it after he did me!

because 99% or more of private parking signage fails to meet the BPA CoP

doesnt matter what it says or if you can read it, if it fails the BPA CoP , then its an appeal point

small fonts , wrong colour , too much info , too much small print , out of date info

download the 2014 BPA CoP, (the last one) , read it , check if the signage conforms (it probably wont)

the point is

if you allege to popla that something is wrong , like no contract, poor signage , not a gpeol , the operator has to prove it meets the CoP, nothing to do with what you or I read, or didnt read

you say to the PPC via popla, prove it , or popla must uphold the appeal

let us assume that you are arrested for shoplifting for example , you would say "no comment" , they have to prove it, show the evidence, beyond reasonable doubt etc, a crude analogy, but its put up, or shut up

so prove it was me
prove I did it
prove the law says I should not have done what I did

ps:- this recent signage failed as it mentioned clamping, which is banned

http://parking-prankster.blogspot.co.uk/2015/07/fastidious-vandal-attacks-car-park.html

so never assume the signage is correct , it rarely is

Diverdave

Thanks again Redx, I have downloaded the BPA CoP and will read it thouroughly to see if i can spot any discrepancies in the signage. Surely though a big company like UKPC would have signage that met the standards??

Redx

you could say that about all the companies involved, but I believe the BPA gave them a few years to comply, yet the signage is what they rely on to form the "contract" of parking

if you check pranksters blogs you will see many examples of poor or inadequate signage, including one that is camouflaged at abersoch golf club

I kid ye not

but the point is, you allege all the flaws in the "contract" , like no landowner contract , poor or inadequate signage, not a gpeol etc, its their job to prove they complied , to the popla assessor (same as they would to a judge , seeing as they are bringing the action)

they have to prove their case, you dont have to prove a defence, merely allege their case is flawed , many times they dont produce the contract, or they redact it , or whatever

stick around a few months and you may learn summat, like I have done for the last 2 years , lol

and I dont know the half of it

on another point , their operative should have arned you that you were breaking the rules of parking and tried to mitigate the losses, it appears this operative didnt do so , making the issue much worse than it would otherwise have been

point that out to a judge (and in your popla appeal), its an added point

that the UKPC operative did nothing to mitigate the problem or damages incurred

plus the general rule is you have say 5 to 10 minutes "grace time" to either comply with the sign, or leave, this wasnt allowed for either