DWP Claim and Estate distribution - advice please.

Shelldean

Thanks keep pedalling, it's really difficult to find stuff about this rule. Most postings are related to people who've given their cash away or spent it to continue claiming.

Best I can find.is this description....
They also use the 'diminishing capital calculation' which means they start with the full amount of savings and then reduce it by the amount the person would be assumed to have needed to withdraw if they were not receiving pension credit.

Weary_soul

This is the best explanation I've found of it....

http://www.rightsnet.org.uk/forum-archive/index7f40.html

Always keep an eye on Rightsnet as there is a lot of valuable info on there.

barryjarcher

Keep_pedalling wrote: »

Did something happen in 2003, which meant he was much better off so no longer needed to claim?

Well I can only assume that as the Pension credit came in he was advised to claim that instead of IS. The DWP have claimed that he was claiming IS between 1993 & 2003 and then PC from 2003 until death.

Now I wasn't privy to his finances but I'm pretty sure he would never of been entitled to PC as he'd of had savings that took him out of the bracket, but before his brother died in 2002/3 and he got inheritance he was nowhere near the savings amount he had at death, but how the hell can I prove this with it being so long ago?

Mojisola

barryjarcher wrote: »

Well I can only assume that as the Pension credit came in he was advised to claim that instead of IS. The DWP have claimed that he was claiming IS between 1993 & 2003 and then PC from 2003 until death.

Now I wasn't privy to his finances but I'm pretty sure he would never of been entitled to PC as he'd of had savings that took him out of the bracket, but before his brother died in 2002/3 and he got inheritance he was nowhere near the savings amount he had at death, but how the hell can I prove this with it being so long ago?

The capital allowance for PC is higher than it was for IS so was he entitled to claim IS?

barryjarcher

Mojisola wrote: »

The capital allowance for PC is higher than it was for IS so was he entitled to claim IS?

This is the problem, I don't know all I have is his situation at death and some statements but nothing going back before 2003.

undaunted

barryjarcher wrote: »

Well I can only assume that as the Pension credit came in he was advised to claim that instead of IS. The DWP have claimed that he was claiming IS between 1993 & 2003 and then PC from 2003 until death.

Now I wasn't privy to his finances but I'm pretty sure he would never of been entitled to PC as he'd of had savings that took him out of the bracket, but before his brother died in 2002/3 and he got inheritance he was nowhere near the savings amount he had at death, but how the hell can I prove this with it being so long ago?

It sounds likely to me that he was legitimately claiming income support (they would have asked for proof of saving etc when he started claiming) and then transferred over to pension credit without having notified them of any inheritance.

Is there a solicitor who can show that the bulk of his estate (almost certainly) came from this 2002 / 03 inheritance from his brother? That might then immediately cause the DWP to stop worrying about trying to trawl for 93 - 03 when he would presumably have been entitled to claim IS & speed things up. Thereafter if he didn't declare the inheritance & wasn't entitled to claim Pension credit at all the calculation ought to be fairly straightforward - whatever he was paid in pension credit & not entitled to they'll ask you to return from his estate.

Keep_pedalling

barryjarcher wrote: »

Well I can only assume that as the Pension credit came in he was advised to claim that instead of IS. The DWP have claimed that he was claiming IS between 1993 & 2003 and then PC from 2003 until death.

Now I wasn't privy to his finances but I'm pretty sure he would never of been entitled to PC as he'd of had savings that took him out of the bracket, but before his brother died in 2002/3 and he got inheritance he was nowhere near the savings amount he had at death, but how the hell can I prove this with it being so long ago?

Well it sounds like he could well have had a legitimate claim for IS up until he inherited from his brother and I don't see how anyone can prove otherwise. From that point however he should not have been able to claim either IS or PC, and DWP should be able to prove that from the public records of his brother's probate and will. Assuming it was a substantial inheritance the estate could face 12 years of PC being clawed back, although this would be offset somewhat as you should be able to claim back some of the IT already paid.

You could estimate the worse case scenario by looking to see how much PC he was getting on recent bank statements and multiply that up for 12 years worth. That could be well over the amount of cash the solicitor is sitting on, and if it was me I would play safe and put the sale of the house purchase with everything else

For that reason I would pay out to the minor beneficiaries, but restrict you and your siblings to a small interim payment.

konark

It's ok the DWP saying the estate owes them money, what is more pertinent is if they can force the estate to pay them this. They have no statutory mechanism to deduct money from deceased estates.

Just playing devils's advocate but what would happen if the executors refused to pay or even acknowledge this debt?

G6JNS

konark wrote: »

It's ok the DWP saying the estate owes them money, what is more pertinent is if they can force the estate to pay them this. They have no statutory mechanism to deduct money from deceased estates.

Just playing devils's advocate but what would happen if the executors refused to pay or even acknowledge this debt?

They can, of course, sue the executors. In some case that might be to the executors advantage since the DWP would then be forced to prove in court not only that they were entitled to the money but how much. Intimidatory tactics don't go down well with judges so thery will not get away with it.

Keep_pedalling

G6JNS wrote: »

They can, of course, sue the executors. In some case that might be to the executors advantage since the DWP would then be forced to prove in court not only that they were entitled to the money but how much. Intimidatory tactics don't go down well with judges so thery will not get away with it.

In this particular case, I would be refusing to pay anything that predates the inheritance as there is no evidence to back up any claim. Quite clearly after the inheritance the claim for PC was not valid and at should be quite easy to work out what the over payment comes to, so provided the DWP calculations match the executors I would look at getting it paid ASAP so I could get any overpayment of IHT sorted and all beneficiaries paid.