Surveyor missed Unsupported Chimney

Landofwood

Hi All,

I recently moved into an Edwardian property which has some sloped floors upstairs. This was noted during the viewings.

I instructed a reputable RICS surveyor to perform a Building Survey, and he made the following comments, amongst others:

"The property is free of serious structural defect".

"The floors are level within expected tolerances".

While living in the property I became concerned that that the slope upstairs was quite significant. I invited a structural engineer over who used a laser to identify that the floors had sloped over 10cm from one side of the room towards the chimney breast at the other side.

He also quickly identified that the slope is towards a chimney breast which has been removed from the downstairs kitchen, probably many decades ago, but does not appear to be supported.

Confusingly the ceiling downstairs appears to be level.

The surveyor made no mention of the chimney breast in his report, nor recommended further investigations.

The surveyor is ignoring me.

What's the protocol here?

Thrugelmir

Landofwood wrote: »

probably many decades ago,

Then why is now an issue?

MisterB1959

floor joists are not normally built into chimney breasts for the simple reason they can catch fire! what normally happens is the joists are 'trimmed' around the breast, so removing the chimney breast should have no affect on the level/slope of the floor. if the ceiling below the sloped floor is level, perhaps the prior owners had a 'false' ceiling installed?

Landofwood

MisterB1959 wrote: »

floor joists are not normally built into chimney breasts for the simple reason they can catch fire! what normally happens is the joists are 'trimmed' around the breast, so removing the chimney breast should have no affect on the level/slope of the floor. if the ceiling below the sloped floor is level, perhaps the prior owners had a 'false' ceiling installed?

We wondered if a false ceiling had been installed, but the ceiling height is the same where the slope should be, as the rest of the house.

We are a little baffled as to how there can be such a significant slope upstairs, but not downstairs.

I checked it with a level this morning. Ceiling perfectly straight, floor above it massively wonky.

Hoploz

I think i would be taking up the carpet ... What can you see? What about taking up the floorboards, does it reveal anything? I'm sure the reason would become apparent. I don't know how chimneys attach to floors, someone above said they aren't. This definitely needs sorting out one way or another, sloping 10cm would make you seasick surely!

Hoploz

....And yes to answer your question I would expect the surveyor to bring up such a slope. I would certainly not consider 10 cm within one room to be within expected tolerances. Unless the room is 100 yards wide of course!

dimbo61

What has your engineer friend recommended ?
Steels to support the chimney ? Move out today the building could fall down.
RICS surveyors cannot lift floor coverings or Dig around the walls or floors.
The property is 100 + years old and a few cracks, movement, slopes may have appeared.
We recently removed a chimney breast from the middle of a 1930,s semi and put in 7 steel RSJ,s
The calculations from the structural engineer went WAY WAY over my head.

MisterB1959

a false ceiling may not be covering a void, it might just be plasterboard fitted directly to the existing ceiling, with a few shims to take out the uneven bits. are you sure one end has dropped and the other end is not suffering from 'heave', lift the carpets and go next door to see if they have a similar issue?

Annie1960

dimbo61 wrote: »

What has your engineer friend recommended ?
Steels to support the chimney ? Move out today the building could fall down.
RICS surveyors cannot lift floor coverings or Dig around the walls or floors.
The property is 100 + years old and a few cracks, movement, slopes may have appeared.
We recently removed a chimney breast from the middle of a 1930,s semi and put in 7 steel RSJ,s
The calculations from the structural engineer went WAY WAY over my head.

This is the issue. Is the property safe to live in, or not? You need to identify this before you can move forward.

If it is safe, then there is no problem.

If it's not safe, then look up the RICS procedure for making a complaint about the original surveyor with the aim of recouping anything it costs you to make the property habitable. Get three quotes first.

Landofwood

MisterB1959 wrote: »

a false ceiling may not be covering a void, it might just be plasterboard fitted directly to the existing ceiling, with a few shims to take out the uneven bits. are you sure one end has dropped and the other end is not suffering from 'heave', lift the carpets and go next door to see if they have a similar issue?

This is a 3200 Sq ft detached house, and only 1 corner of the 1st floor is sloped. I went up to the loft yesterday, bare floor boards and perfectly level.

If they have installed a false ceiling, they have installed it over the entire ceiling of the downstairs which doesn't make any sense at all.

I think I need some more professional advice as I am still baffled.

Thanks all for your help.

Tassotti

Landofwood wrote: »

Hi All,

I recently moved into an Edwardian property which has some sloped floors upstairs. This was noted during the viewings.

I instructed a reputable RICS surveyor to perform a Building Survey, and he made the following comments, amongst others:

"The property is free of serious structural defect".

"The floors are level within expected tolerances".

While living in the property I became concerned that that the slope upstairs was quite significant. I invited a structural engineer over who used a laser to identify that the floors had sloped over 10cm from one side of the room towards the chimney breast at the other side.

He also quickly identified that the slope is towards a chimney breast which has been removed from the downstairs kitchen, probably many decades ago, but does not appear to be supported.

Confusingly the ceiling downstairs appears to be level.

The surveyor made no mention of the chimney breast in his report, nor recommended further investigations.

The surveyor is ignoring me.

What's the protocol here?

How could he tell if it was supported or not without looking at it properly?

I had the same thing. However, the surveyor DID mention that the breast has been removed downstairs and couldn't confirm if the breast above was supported.

My builder chipped away some plaster and cut a hole in the ceiling in the kitchen and we found it was supported.

Took pics for when I resell.

This will obviously create damage and expense for you, but will be the only way you will find out