Lied on Property information Form? -What can I do...

filbrit

Hi there guys

was hoping to get some advice. Basically we moved to a victorian house with a cellar. On the property information form 7.1 Has any part of the property ever been flooded? and 7.2 which part.

On 7.1 the vendors answered NO.

Now whenever it rains continuously for about 4 hours or more (depends how strong it pours) sometimes with in 2 hours a small section on the cellar about 1/5 its size builds a puddled of water 1-2 inches and will drain a few hours after it stops raining.

Does this constitute flooding and if so should the vendors have ticked YES? Ground water from below the cellar


On 7.2 as they answered NO they left it blank.

I do not believe that in the 10 years they have lived there they never knew about it. As it was the same before we moved and after we moved. They just mentioned a bit damp but never water coming in from below the bricks on floor of cellar.

If they lied and can be proven by a surveyor that this has been an ongoing thing prior to our purchase...

A) Does this constitute flooding to be answered yes on the form?
If they lied is there any recourse we can do to compensate and have it rectified by a professional waterproofer? (Tanking etc. DPC )

Apologies for the lengthy email but we are wits end what to do.

Many thanks in advance.

G_M

A) yes

claim the cost of repair, via the courts if they refuse to pay.

Do you have legal cover with your house insurance? Or via your union/employer? If so, see if they will take up the claim.

You will need hard evidence though - as you say a surveyor's report (which you'll need to pay for & then claim back if you win).

cloo

I suspect the vendors were fudging a bit and thought 'Oh, well it's not exactly flooding'. We had a similar problem in the cellar of our flat that we sold recently and we said 'No' to flooding, as we thought that would be a bit alarming, but we did declare underneath that there was a small flow of water in the cellar. We got a specialist surveyor in to look it over who reported it wasn't unsual and wouldn't cause any structural problems etc. Still put a lot of people off the flat, which was very annoying (though I can kind of understand). We think it only started happening when a neighbour reconcreted their cellar, which meant a little water from an underground stream started going into our cellar rather than theirs! It definitely didn't happen in our first few years there.

It's possible that similar has happened to your vendors - if they didn't go down their much, and if they never went in after or during rain and it started recently, they might not have noticed it.

Unless you are planning to convert it into a useable room, tanking would be overkill. The specialist surveyor we had look at ours stressed that these spaces were never meant to be watertight - his view was that as long as the water is draining away and not building up, it's not a problem, and that if it became worrisome, the answer was a sump and pump, that would cost a few hundred to buy and install.

As it happens, we've moved about 100m up the same road... our vendors declared there to be no flooding in the basement and we did ask if there might be any water at all coming in and if so where, they still said no. It does appear to be pretty dry - however, friends of ours who live two doors down said they used to get a foot or so of water after heavy rain, but they have solved that with a pump and it's not a problem any more.

TBH, I don't imagine this is really worth persuing the vendors for, though I know from experience that it is something offputting if you want to sell on. It may be worth getting an independent specialist as we did (not someone who has an interest in selling you anything) to assess if it's a problem and to give you a report that may help when you come to sell or want to make a claim, depending on their conclusions.

DTDfanBoy

The tricky bit will be proving that the vendors knew about the issue, if it needs hours of continuous rainfall to flood, and then drains within a few hours, it's possible that the vendors never knew it was prone to flooding.

filbrit

Thanks for your replies guys, really insightful.

I do doubt if they did not know about it as they have lived there for at least 10 years and we have lived there like 6 months and i those 6 months about 8-10 times if flooded when it rained hard and continuous.

Are the PIF legally binding? The waterproofing surveyor said that the bricks of the cellar are just laid over clay, sand and stone as it is below ground level it will always accumulate water when it rains hard and continuous. Just how it is kinda thing. But what I do not know if why the vendors ticked no.

Yes I know it can be a bit of a palava to go through contesting and getting compensated for it. But is there anything to stand on to at least to make us go though the whole process?

Anyone here won a case from mis-declaration on Property Information Form?

Many thanks

lincroft1710

As previous posters have said, it is possible the vendors were not aware there was water coming into and laying on a small part of the cellar. To me "flood" would be all of the cellar being covered, so again there is an argument that they were not lying.

Thirdly it is possible that after about 120 years the water has eventually eroded the structure of the house enough to find a way in, it may not have previously happened.

So you may have an uphill struggle and if you lose you may be faced with paying the vendor's costs.

poppasmurf_bewdley

I can't solve your problem, but the dictionary definition of flood is:

"an overflow of a large amount of water beyond its normal limits, especially over what is normally dry land." Make of that what you will. I think the emphasis would be on the word 'overflow'.

Davesnave

This is quite common and usually solved by creating a sump containing automatic Hippo-type pump to a convenient drain or the garden. Tanking would be overkill.

If you decide to claim, and I wouldn't, it would be best to make your remedial action appropriate to the situation, so that you don't look as if you are seeking betterment.

(Oops I see cloo has already covered this very adequately. That'll teach to answer without reading properly! )

moneyistooshorttomention

"Misrepresentation" is the word you want - officialise for lying.

Yep ...they did lie.

Flooding is flooding (like you cant be a little bit dead, as either you are dead or you aren't).

I would have thought most people would be planning on using their cellar for something - and therefore require the floor to stay dry.

One of the houses I checked out when I swopped house recently has a cellar and my reaction to that was "Oh...goody = lots of storage space for junk room stuff and a 'cold store' for preserved food" and that is what I would have used it for if I had bought that house. The thought didn't cross my mind that it might be liable to flooding (of any level) and I would have been more than a little aggrieved to go down to my cellar and find my possessions were soggy.

kingstreet

Is there drainage in the cellar, or a soak-away?

We lived in a three story Edwardian semi when I was younger and the cellar had a soak-away which would sometimes send some fluid back onto the cellar floor when the ground water rose in heavy rain.

Davesnave

moneyistooshorttomention wrote: »

The thought didn't cross my mind that it might be liable to flooding (of any level) and I would have been more than a little aggrieved to go down to my cellar and find my possessions were soggy.

But that would have been down to your lack of experience with cellars, most of which do become damp, unless they have been tanked.

Many also have water in them to a depth of several inches when the water table is high. Without tanking, it's often inevitable.

In other words, occasional ingress of water and dampness is what to expect of a cellar, unless you are told otherwise.