Boundary fence dilemma

karlfoster87

Hi,

I have been directed to this forum by the green-fingered board, and hope that people here may have some insight. I have a dilemma...and apologies for the long story, this is a good opportunity to vent!

Currently we are going through negotiation with our neighbors to erect a very nice and expensive fence both sides of garden to replace the existing ugly green mesh boundary fence that has been in since the properties were developed in 2003.

As you would expect we own the rights to one side, but as a common courtesy we wanted to let everyone know what our plans were and created an in depth document with measurements, 3d models, plans etc to help them best understand. And importantly point out that we did not expect either of our neighbors to pay anything as this was primarily our choice.

The side we own according to the deeds were extremely happy with the plans and gave us immediate approval without any issue. The other side however has been a nightmare...

This is a property that is rented out by its owner, but they are currently trying to sell. We got in touch with the leasing agent to help forward on the information to the owner. After a bit of chasing we were hit with a flat out refusal on the grounds that they wanted us to do the work when the place is sold as they didn't want it to interfere.

Obviously with the summer coming we are keen to have the fence up and gain a little privacy. So we pressed the issue further, confirming that the work would be done professionally and all work will be carried out over one day, which we can arrange with them to avoid a clash with any viewings. We also had confirmed that the current residents were happy with us to step into the garden to carry out the work whenever needed. We thought that after being so flexible and going "by the book" we surely would receive a positive response.... Turns out not. Another refusal, this time with no grounds.

The leasing agent told us directly that she strongly recommended the approval of work, as the change would do nothing but increase the value of the house. To help us out she gave me the direct contact number of the estate agent handling the sale of the property as they would have more weight on the recommendation.

After speaking to the estate agent they seemed in full agreement with the leasing agent and promised to get in contact and request a response from the owner. Two weeks later we have heard nothing.

Ok, so that's the back story, the dilemma I have is that I have just noticed what appears to be an error in our favour of the original build of the house.

Both our house and the one in question are detached. The current fence, despite being declared on the deeds as owned by the other house is in fact build entirely within our side of the boundary. The further out part of the fence post never exceeds the brickwork of our garage!

Am I in the clear to rip this down and place my own fence as this falls under my own property, and on a technical level, although having ownership, they do not currently possess any boundary fence of their own?

I have a link to an image below which demonstrates the layout. (please remove the space in http to view - new user limitations)
ht tp://i57.tinypic.com/23wnuoh.jpg

Thanks in advance for anyone that can help or has any words of advice.

Kind regards
Karl.

HB58

You do not need your neighbour's permission to erect a fence on your own land.

societys_child

Don't confuse responsibility for the boundary with responsibility for the fence.

As above ^ You could simply erect your new fence a couple of millimetres in from the existing "ugly green mesh boundary fence" provided you don't damage it or cross the boundary.

karlfoster87

You do not need your neighbour's permission to erect a fence on your own land.

I suppose the real question I am asking is whether I am correct in assuming, that, although the boundary is the responsibility of my neighbour, would people agree with my statements of the existing fence being on my land, in being set behind the brickwork by the original builders?

societys_child

Read your full post now . . . not sure about ripping down the existing fence, then again, if it's definitely on your land, you should be able to do what you want with it.

DTDfanBoy

karlfoster87 wrote: »

I suppose the real question I am asking is whether I am correct in assuming, that, although the boundary is the responsibility of my neighbour, would people agree with my statements of the existing fence being on my land, in being set behind the brickwork by the original builders?

Who's to say that the fence is on your land, perhaps your garage wall was built on your neighbours land

If your neighbour doesn't want the new fence, and is in the process of selling, perhaps you should consider leaving the fence building until after the property has sold.

If you can't wait then you should build a fence inside the existing one, pulling down a fence owned by your neighbour is asking for trouble

PasturesNew

Your mistake was in not just sticking the fence up. If in doubt, or it's somebody else's fence on/at the boundary, then simply install yours inside that (leaving the original fence in place and out of sight to you).

You made a mountain out of a molehill really.

G_M

1) who owns the existing ugly green wesh? If it it owned by the neighbour, be careful!

You could argue that as his fence is on your land, he is trespassing, and you could remove it and return it to him (do not throw it away).

2) If you are right about the fence not being on the boundary, then yes, of course you can erect your own fence inside the boundary on your land. But you may be kicking off a dispute about where the boundary actually is........

Have you posted on the gardenlaw forum?

SplanK

Very odd... we sold our house and did a couple of viewings whilst the fence was in mid replacement. We didn't see it as being an issue, but sold it as "hey, these fences are being replaced, other than painting you don't have to worry about them for a fair few years!"


The old ones were tatty and JUST about holding together after the winds over the last couple of years so they needed doing, as well as new concrete posts because the others were frost damaged!

lonestar1

perhaps mention your going ahead unless of course they would like to start a dispute (Obviously your neighbour would need to declare this to any buyers LOL)

karlfoster87

Who's to say that the fence is on your land, perhaps your garage wall was built on your neighbours land

The garage was part of the original build of the property so in theory should adhere to the building faces rule that declares the external face of the structure as the boundary line,excluding the footing and eaves.

The placement of the fence within my side of boundary (extended from this wall line according to the title plans) appears to be a cosmetic and cost saving decision, as temporary structure.

perhaps mention your going ahead unless of course they would like to start a dispute (Obviously your neighbour would need to declare this to any buyers LOL)

Brash, but I think this may be our best course of action. With the only stated reservation from the homeowner being us interfering with the sale the potential of us beginning a boundary dispute while they try to sell would have a far greater impact

Having potential ownership of the existing boundary property (though not boundary responsibility), their advisories from both the leasing agent and estate agent to proceed, and the fact that they hold no personal interest in the property beyond it being their financial asset - a scare tactic may be enough for them to finally give us a "fine, just do it".