Highview PCN but have ticket

Lost_poet

I would really welcome some help on a PCN received in the last 14 days from Highview parking. They are BPA member and use POPLA. The car park is pay and display. I had a ticket. It's using ANPR.

They have sent a 'charge notice' and photos of the vehicle recorded on their 'client's property' saying they do not have evidence that a sufficient parking payment was made to cover the full duration of the visit. they do not say who the client is.

They write to me as the keeper, and request that I pass on the name of the driver who is required to pay £85 within 28 days, and if it is not paid an initial debt collection fee of £40.

I have 28 days to appeal to their appeals office.

I bought a ticket for £2 for 2 hours as I usually do, I stayed for 1 hour 30 mins. This is confirmed on their camera times in and out. However having received this notice I checked my ticket and it has only given 1 hours time!

I returned to check the car park signage and discovered the boards have now got new bits stuck over the charges which have gone up to £2.50!

Now I swear that the signs did not have the increased price on the day they say I overstayed, but I cannot prove this. I have the parking ticket but it says £2 paid but only gives 1 hour time so I'm not sure which grounds to appeal on? Particularly after the Beavis result reduced GPEOL I think?

I have read the newbies thread and indeed successfully appealed a euro car parks PCN on a free parking site last August using your templates. But this is a different situation as P and D and I paid but allegedly not enough.

Should I try an appeal on the grounds I bought a ticket and the machine gave the wrong time to leave? Or they have put the price up on the machine but it was not displayed on the notice thus underpayment? Or just try GPEOL and template letter.......if so which one is best to use?

I'm really fed up as I always pay and leave in time and can't afford £85 for a 50p overstay...or so they say!:(

Hope someone can advise.....many thanks.

The_Slithy_Tove

Just use the normal appeal points as per the NEWBIES thread. You owe them 50p, nothing more. Asking for £85 is plain greedy. In fact, there's another non-conformance for POFA. They must ask for the OUTSTANDING parking charge. Even if they expect £85 from you, they should be asking for £85, as you've paid £2.
GPEOL will win outright.

Lost_poet

Thanks That sounds promising.:o

Should I say I have a ticket for £2 etc and that they have a fault at their end or not even bother?

hoohoo

The BPA code of practice suggest temporary warning signs if the parking conditions change. I suggest you also ask if they did this, and are prepared to waive the charge if not.

Lost_poet

Thanks for the suggestion. I guess in all of this I write as the keeper and refer to 'the driver' purchasing a ticket?

Lost_poet

Please can a regular check this amended from the newbies first appeal ....Many thanks.

Dear Sirs

Re: PCN No. ....................

I challenge this 'PCN' as keeper of the car, on these main grounds:

a). The sum does not represent a genuine pre-estimate of loss, nor is it a core price term. It is extravagant and unconscionable when compared to local parking charges issued by the Council so cannot be justified.
The driver purchased a ticket for £2.00 for 2 hours stay and left within the allotted time.
Since the date in question the prices have clearly been increased by 50p as can be seen on the signs, which now have extra new prices stuck over them. There were no temporary signs in place, as recommended by the BPA code of practice, indicating an increase in price on the date in question and £2 for 2 hours has been the standard charge at this car park.
b). As keeper I believe that the signs were not clearly displayed and the terms and conditions notice is hidden at the back away from the entrance, the wording is ambiguous and the predominant purpose of your business model is to deter.
c). There is no evidence that you have any proprietary interest in the land.
The landowner Mr Paul Walters has been quoted in the Stoke Sentinel saying that people who have purchased a ticket and are being treated unfairly should appeal to Highview to have the charge dropped and that he was horrified that people who bought a ticket were being fined.
d). Your 'Notice' fails to comply with the POFA 2012 and breaches various consumer contract/unfair terms Regulations.
e). There was no consideration nor acceptance flowing from both parties and any contract with myself, or the driver, is denied.

Your client is clearly concerned about how you treat consumers visiting his premises. He has publicly stated that his intention is to provide cheap parking and get people to buy a ticket. The driver purchased a valid ticket and made sufficient parking payment. As keeper I shall be sending him a strong letter of concern regarding your management of his premises.

The purpose of this communication is:

1. Formal challenge
There will be no admissions as to who was driving and no assumptions can be drawn. As such, you must either rely on the POFA 2012 or cancel the charge. I suggest you uphold this challenge now and drop all ‘charges’ or alternatively, send a rejection letter.

2. ''Drop hands'' offer
The extravagant 'parking charge' is baseless but I realise that you may have incurred nominal postage costs. Equally, I have incurred costs to date, for responding to your mail. It is clear that my costs and yours, at this point, do not exceed £15. Therefore, this is a formal “drop hands” offer. I remind you of the duty to mitigate any loss, so withdraw the spurious charge within 35 days without further expense and I will not pursue you for my costs. If you persist then I will charge in full for my time at £18 per hour plus my out-of-pocket expenses and damages for harassment.

3. Notice of cancellation of contract
I hereby give notice of withdrawal from this alleged ‘contract’, which was never properly offered by you and certainly was not expressly agreed. This 'contract' is hereby cancelled and any obligations now end. If you offer - and if I decide to use - IAS or POPLA, then the contract ends immediately on the date of their decision (whatever the outcome) so my notice of cancellation still applies. The Consumer Contracts (Information, Cancellation & Additional Payments) Regulations apply now to every consumer contract, save for a few exemptions, which parking contracts are not. Following the EU Consumer Rights Directive, express consent must be obtained for consumer contracts now - not implied consent. You have failed to meet these requirements and you did not serve the driver with the terms by durable medium.

By replying to the challenge you are acknowledging receipt and acceptance of points 2 and 3 above.

I have kept proof of submission of this challenge. I look forward to your considered reply within 35 days.

Yours faithfully,

I will also send a photo of the sign with the new prices stuck over the top, and of the ticket purchased.....or is that a bad idea as the exit time will be earlier than the ANPR camera time exiting....but that's because I thought it was 2 hours stay...

Thanks for any help with this.

ColliesCarer

Good research finding the quotes from the landowner.

Re; The ticket - does it also show the fee paid and the entrance time?

Guys_Dad

In your case, after reading the OP, I would be tempted at this stage to write saying that the driver paid the requisite amount on the board at the time for the parking required.

Upon checking later when you received the NtK, you have seen that the charges have gone up. Can they advise what date that occurred as it seems that the board in question may not have been amended with the sticker until sometime later. Under these circumstances, you would ask for the charge to be dropped.

You have a chance with PE that they might cancel if you adopt that approach - you have 0% if you send the appeal you have posted.

If they don't cancel, then send the appeal above as a 2nd appeal so it is on file if court arises.

Lost_poet

Thanks to you both.
The ticket shows fee paid and expiry time ... 25 mins over the photo exit time, but the ticket was on the dash and I knew I had paid for 2 hours and only stayed an hour and a half.
No entry time. Just the date.

Guys Dad- are you suggesting I put just what you wrote more or less in a soft appeal to their better nature?! ...and no points from the newbie thread? Should I leave out all the stuff I found on the landowner ..... Then put everything in if they refuse to drop it?

Do you agree with The Slithy Tove's earlier suggestion that they would drop on GPEOL and can only claim 50p anyway if it goes further?

Guys_Dad

Always write as the RK but you need not say who the driver was at the time.

I don't think it is a soft appeal - I think that you should be quite firm, but polite, in your appeal and ask them to check that the machines were not altered before the notices.

You can add that 1 hour's current parking is not £2 (assuming that's correct) and you clearly thought you were paying for 2 hours, confirming in your mind that the notice and machines were out of sync.

Unfortunately, since Beavis appeal court and until the appeal is lodged with the Supreme court, our normal advice on appeal points is not as strong as it was and there is nothing to be lost by an initial appeal on the facts. You can always send a supplementary appeal to PE based on the technical points so that they have notice of what you may use at POPLA or court.

Lost_poet

Many thanks. I have sent off the letter along the lines you suggested and we shall see what they say! Fingers crossed.