pcn due to rail delay

Paddie01

Just a thought - given my commute that day took a total of 7 hours - there and back - as opposed to the normal 2 Southern are going to refund me the full ticket price - why should this not apply to the car park?

The_Slithy_Tove

Paddie01 wrote: »

Just a thought - given my commute that day took a total of 7 hours - there and back - as opposed to the normal 2 Southern are going to refund me the full ticket price - why should this not apply to the car park?

Because the railways are a regulated industry, the private parking is an unregulated Wild West. Does your charge notice say anything about Byelaw 14? Southern are a bit notorious for obfuscating the issue, and passing the alleged debt to a branch of Southern Railway to make increasing threats. They are on dodgy legal ground, as can be demonstrated whenever challenged on the precise nature of the charge and who is liable - they go all waffly and evasive.

Paddie01

all it says is - " this car park is regulated by the terms and conditions of parking displayed at the car park by entering ............"


the pcn is issued on behalf of Southern by Meteor

Quentin

Paddie01 wrote: »

Just a thought - given my commute that day took a total of 7 hours - there and back - as opposed to the normal 2 Southern are going to refund me the full ticket price - why should this not apply to the car park?

Your problem seems to be you never paid for the car park!


You can't expect Southern to reimburse you a car park charge you chose not to pay!


Concentrate on the newbies thread. (This "thought" is a non starter to get your charge reimbursed)

Paddie01

well we could call it scratch ! - but thanks will go to the newbies thread

ColliesCarer

If you take a look at the info on parking at East Grinstead Southern's web site (linked below)

http://www.southernrailwayparking.com/carpark.asp?station_id=60

Then click on terms and you will find the following information

http://www.southernrailwayparking.com/termsfull.asp

Check out section 14 Enforcement - were byelaws are mentioned.


Meteor at Railway car parks (i.e. subject to Bylaws) were known to mess about not sending out an NtK but instead going straight to debt collectors letters threatening Magistrates court under those byelaws.

So forum advice has previously been - (See Ho87's proviso in post #18 first)
To send in an appeal in response to the PCN windscreen ticket but as KEEPER (not driver) and sending it after about 21 days from date of issue of the PCN so that it arrives close to the end of the 28 day appeal deadline but before they could issue an NtK.

This is for a good reason - an NtK must arrive between days 29 and 56 for POFA 2012 Schedule 4 keeper liability. By appealing early as keeper, then sending a POPLA as late as possible the 56 days may well be exceeded without them ever having issued the required NtK and you have a slam dunk win on no keeper liability as they have failed to comply with the statutory requirements.

I believe this advice still applies - but I've had a bit of a break from the forum for a few months so just check that the regulars agree this is still the best course of action with Meteor.

Also if you use Search the Forum function using search terms "Meteor" and "Southern" (search posts) you will find similar cases to yours - one by fuziduck comes to mind were the appeal early strategy was followed.

HO87

What he said ^^^

Always provided that there is no mention of railway byelaws either on the signage but more particularly on the PCN.

I suggest - as already pointed out by hoohoo - that you specifically incorporate a section in your appeal relating to frustration of contract in that by force of circumstances beyond your control you were prevented from paying by phone, returning promptly to your vehicle and thereby fulfilling your contractual obligations.

The fact that in a car park which allows the facility to pay by phone it is always going to be impossible to display a valid ticket or voucher - the breach they have specified is therefore a nonsense.

Paddie01

further to the above - I have received an NTK dated 13th July for the "offence" dated 30th April - so 74 days after - is this material

The_Slithy_Tove

Paddie01 wrote: »

further to the above - I have received an NTK dated 13th July for the "offence" dated 30th April - so 74 days after - is this material

Not really. The 56 day timescale is there for POFA compliance only. Seeing as this is a railway car park subject to Byelaws, POFA is not relevant anyway.

Paddie01

thanks - so the advise sent by colliescare is not valid


"This is for a good reason - an NtK must arrive between days 29 and 56 for POFA 2012 Schedule 4 keeper liability. By appealing early as keeper, then sending a POPLA as late as possible the 56 days may well be exceeded without them ever having issued the required NtK and you have a slam dunk win on no keeper liability as they have failed to comply with the statutory requirements. "