Letter from church - Formal notice of church rate due!

ben500

marleyboy wrote: »

If its nothing more than a voluntary request, does that mean the OP doesnt have to pay it?

Absolutely

Poppy9

superscaper wrote: »

Very very good point. Just last night we were explaining to my nan that a letter she got claiming she'd won a holiday was basically a scam (all you have to do is attend a timeshare demo etc). I'm sure they worded it perfectly legally and everything, doesn't make it moral and not everyone is in a position to make an informed decision on their actions.

In this case if they weren't trying to take advantage of vulnerable people as well then why use a mailshot, why not just send the letters to the church's parishioners only, or even better just hand them out in the church services, that way you aren't wasting letters and sending unsolicited mail to people who want nothing to do with the church.

You would expect people they were mailshotting to live locally and be aware of the church so they could easily check if it was a scam by just ringing the vicar.

Also if they just gave out letters at church services to parishioners they would miss out all the people living local and those that have moved away but return to use the church for special ocassions like christenings, weddings and funerals. Lots of people expect their local church to be ready and willing to host them when they want to celebrate or commemorate but they don't want to contribute to the everyday running costs. Parishioners who attend church regularly give money every week to keep the church going.

The other option for the church to remain viable is to charge a proper market rate for the use of it's facilities at special events (CofE charges a fixed amount and RC nothing at all), however you can see the headlines in the local rag now if the church starts charging £1000 per funeral!!!:rolleyes:

superscaper

ben500 wrote: »

Nonsense. Please demonstrate how church rates are scamming and how you compare such as the above with "church rates" which are legitamate requests.

It could easily confuse people into thinking it's a necessary payment in the same way those clothing leaflets might make people think it's for charity. I did put the word scams in quotations for a reason, not just for fun. Unsolicited mail asking for something off you is all the same category to me whether some consider them to be scams or not I'd put it in the same file (bin).

EDIT: they are not scams, I put them in same category as all unsolicited mail which includes scams, the quotations meant some I'm including mail that are scams and the ones that aren't. I was simply categorising it at the same level as scams, within the same set of annoying binnable items that should never have been sent to me but the subsets themselves can be mutually exclusive (surely you remember your Venn diagram days), ie not all unsolicited mail are scams.

superscaper

Poppy9 wrote: »

You would expect people they were mailshotting to live locally and be aware of the church so they could easily check if it was a scam by just ringing the vicar.

I personally would have no idea of my local churches even though I've lived here for 25 years. I have no reason to take notice of where they are. It's not a question of whether the vicar really sent them or not, I was already assuming they did when I gave my opinion. It would be interesting to see what the reaction would be if it was a local mosque that did the same thing. I'd be just as miffed if the local McDonalds sent a letter asking for voluntary donations for renovations.

MarkyMarkD

Somerset wrote: »

I used to work for a company that owned commercial property that was within the confines of a 'church area'. They annually received their voluntary church rates demand and paid. It was completely legit. Now I just assumed it could only be levied on companies, not individuals - but this assumption could be completely wrong. But I know in my ex-employers case as well as being legit it had been going on for yonks and was well established. Also I know this 'chancel liability' stuff is now commonplace whereas it was unheard of before, but I don't know if it's one and the same thing.

The OP stated that the letter was received by his company at their offices, so the leap to "grannies getting scared to death" in earlier posts is even more silly than some of the earlier ones about "scams".

MarkyMarkD

Superscraper

You can be "miffed" as much as you like; you can treat the voluntary request with disdain as much as you like.

But to go round calling a legitimate, legal, request a "scam" (even in quotes) is simply wrong.

Poppy9

superscaper wrote: »

I personally would have no idea of my local churches even though I've lived here for 25 years. I have no reason to take notice of where they are. It's not a question of whether the vicar really sent them or not, I was already assuming they did when I gave my opinion. It would be interesting to see what the reaction would be if it was a local mosque that did the same thing. I'd be just as miffed if the local McDonalds sent a letter asking for voluntary donations for renovations.

Most people know where their local churches are even if they don't attend - they are the buildings with the big pointy bits:D

There is a difference between being miffed and saying it's a scam. The OP said that the letter stated they were voluntary. If a mosque or Mac sent the same letter and asked for voluntary donations I would just bin it - the same as the one from the CofE church!

superscaper

MarkyMarkD wrote: »

But to go round calling a legitimate, legal, request a "scam" (even in quotes) is simply wrong.

I agree. Which is why I haven't said "the church rates request is a scam". I apologise for the ambiguity arising from the simile, I'll be more literal and explicit next time.

superscaper

Poppy9 wrote: »

There is a difference between being miffed and saying it's a scam.

I agree. Which is why I haven't said "the church rates request is a scam". There is also a difference between specifically calling something a scam and saying one thinks of all unsolicited mail including scams are in the same category and deserve to be binned.

I apologise for the misunderstanding, I'll make it clearer next time.

ben500

superscaper wrote: »

I agree. Which is why I haven't said "the church rates request is a scam". There is also a difference between specifically calling something a scam and saying one thinks of all unsolicited mail including scams are in the same category and deserve to be binned.

I apologise for the misunderstanding, I'll make it clearer next time.

All very well, yet each time you post you make a comparison between church donations and scams or scamming your agenda is clear.