LL Selling Property - Advice Appreciated

G_M

Rainy-Days wrote: »

Sorry, she has just mentioned to me right now on the phone, that he sent her this text saying he is coming on Monday (no negotiation with her as to whether this was okay or not) and that he would be bringing two estate agents with him.

He told her what time they would be coming. She agreed to it and has not been obstinate in any way. He is telling her and expecting her to capitulate! I just don't think this is right at all.

This is not black and white. There is a middle ground, which in most cases is the best way to go.

When they come round on Monday, she could (should?) make clear that yes, she is willing to allow the EAs to bring prospective buyers round, but only
a) on one/two days per week specified by her
b) after confirming each visit in advance with her
c) either in her presence/absence (whichever she prefers)
d) only between X O'Clock and Y O'Clock
etc (or whatever conditions she can handle)

I'd suggest she also make clear she'll keep the place reasonably tidy, but is NOT going to keep it 'spick & span' for the LL's benefit

She could offer to be more flexible re cleaning & access, but only if the LL agrees to halve the rent.

If the LL/EAs dismiss this reasonable approach & try to bully her and imply they have the right to come whenever they want, she should simply say she is not happy with that, but not argue further (do not agree, but do not argue). She should then write formally to the LL afterwards saying she is not willing to have her 'Quiet Enjoyment' of the tenancy breached and does not agree to any viewings.

She should then change the locks (keep the old ones to fit back when she leaves).

Rainy-Days

Can she actually refuse to do any viewings even though she is on a month by month tenancy?

The house is immaculate. She was out in garden last weekend jet washing the patio, he knew about this because he came round to pick up his mail; the house is very clean - always.

The thing is if she asks for a rent reduction could he be a 'git' and give her a bad reference? She is searching for other property now because of what he is doing. The thing is, if she writes to him and does not agree to any viewings then I guess he will evict her? That's not going to be good for a new LL.

It's trying to find a middle line here and at the moment he is calling all the shots because he thinks he can and is being pretty arrogant about it all.

I told her that the houses round there have been on the market for well over a year and they are in fact done up - new kitchens bathrooms etc. The one she has it needs about £30k spending on it. I said to her he would be stupid to get rid of her while the house is up for sale because it is an income source while they are trying to sell.

G_M

Rainy-Days wrote: »

Can she actually refuse to do any viewings even though she is on a month by tenancy?
Whether the tenany is fixed term or periodic makes no difference. Of course, with a periodic, he LL could immediately issue a S21 Notice (two months) as I advised above, hence my suggestion that middle ground is best.
The LL could also apply to a court for access for viewings, but this is likely to take time and few LL's would bother. More likely to evict.


The thing is if she asks for a rent reduction could he be a 'git' and give her a bad reference?
The LL is an individual. All individuals are diferent. I've never met him. I have no idea if he'd consider this a reasonable request and agree, consider it reasonable, but disagree, or get in a strop and give a bad reference!
She is searching for other property now because of what he is doing. The thing is, if she writes to him and does not agree to any viewings then I guess he will evict her? That's not going to be good for a new LL.
Hence my advice to meet in themiddle ground if possible. Refusing all access is extreme & only sensible if the LL is also being extreme ie insisting on access at any time without warning
It's trying to find a middle line here and at the moment he is calling all the shots because he thinks he can and is being pretty arrogant about it all.
So politely suggest the middle ground!

.

.......................................................................................................

AdrianC

Seems she has three choices here...

1. Accept that her sofa is going to be in some RM photos...
2. Empty the rooms of her possessions so that the photographer can take pics without them in, then move everything back into place again.
3. Receive a letter giving her notice and move out, so that the landlord can take photos with vacant possession.

I said to her he would be stupid to get rid of her while the house is up for sale because it is an income source while they are trying to sell.

And how, exactly, is he going to try to sell the place without any photos on the details, because she won't allow her furniture to be in the pics and won't allow viewings? Let's say she goes for my option 2 - and photos are taken without her furniture in... What's going to happen on the viewings? She's going to stand in front of the sofa, and refuse to allow anybody to look in that direction?

You say she's "not being difficult"... I'd hate to hear your idea of "difficult", then.

Rainy-Days

Hang on minute Adrian she has never said to me about the fact that the furniture will not be in situ when there is viewings - what she has made clear to me and the EA is that she will not allow him to use her effects to allow the EA to publish those images of her effects in both literature and on the internet. I have also made that crystal clear here in my postings that the photos reflect the published literature on the internet and elsewhere.

It is simply not right and fair for a LL to assume that they can just make demands and the tenant is going to accede to those demands. He is taking all this as a given right - when in fact it is not.

There is a specific difference here. The LL was the one who said he wanted to use her furniture for show casing the house and it was the LL who sent her a text saying he was coming on Monday with the EA's giving her zero option. She has agreed to this and has not be obstinate at all.

All in all she is going to take G_M's suggestion and ask the LL for a reduction in the rent to at least half and for that she will allow the photos to be taken with her effects in situ and that she will accommodate the EA's access on the clear proviso that she gets that rent reduction.

I own my home but if some LL did that across me I would be hopping mad and the text he sent to her was downright diabolical - and I have read it.

AdrianC

Rainy-Days wrote: »

Hang on minute Adrian she has never said to me about the fact that the furniture will not be in situ when there is viewings - what she has made clear to me and the EA is that she will not allow him to use her effects to allow the EA to publish those images of her effects in both literature and on the internet. I have also made that crystal clear here in my postings that the photos reflect the published literature on the internet and elsewhere.

If she's so protective of anybody seeing her sofa on t'internet, how come she's happy for Tom, !!!!!! or Harry to see it in the flesh? Won't they steal its soul, too?

All in all she is going to take G_M's suggestion and ask the LL for a reduction in the rent to at least half and for that she will allow the photos to be taken with her effects in situ

She's funny. She's so funny that the landlord's going to decide the path of least resistance is just to give her notice and market the place empty.

Seriously - how, exactly, does she think the EA photos are going to get taken WITHOUT her furniture in them?

agrinnall

What does she think is going to happen if her furniture is in the photos? Is it emblazoned with her bank account details and mobile phone number? Personally I think she's being ridiculous and should find something that actually matters to worry about.

Rainy-Days

AdrianC wrote: »

If she's so protective of anybody seeing her sofa on t'internet, how come she's happy for Tom, !!!!!! or Harry to see it in the flesh? Won't they steal its soul, too?

You have answered your own question - anybody can see it on the internet, there is a difference in people coming to actually view a property which will be substantially less in number - you do know that don't you?

AdrianC wrote: »

She's funny. She's so funny that the landlord's going to decide the path of least resistance is just to give her notice and market the place empty.

Seriously - how, exactly, does she think the EA photos are going to get taken WITHOUT her furniture in them?

That may well be the case that she decides to leave, but it is not up to the LL to make demands and she capitulates. That is wrong. In point of fact G_M is right, she takes the middle ground and if he does not agree to it, then fine she gives her notice. She has been a model tenant and caused no issues, looked after the property very well. This has come as a bolt out of the blue, he is texting and phoning her and he is directing everything.

She is having to take Monday off work (at short notice) to accommodate him which frankly is out of order (because apparently he can't be bothered to arrange evening EA's viewings or so he claims).

And that is going to be the killer for the LL to market the place empty - and everybody knows it. Even the EA has advised him of this. The houses round here take a long time to sell. One has been on the market identical to hers and it is still up for sale 12 months on and it is marketed at a reasonable price as well. He can have an empty property with no rent for 12 months plus whilst he tries to sell. That will be his problem along with paying council tax on an empty property.

G_M is right the middle ground and if he disagrees that's just tough. It will mean empty or having to rent it out for another six months on a secured tenancy and start the process all over again.

As a Landlord you can't just assume and take everything as a given right and you can't crap on your tenants, get them to take time off work, demand that their effects are in pictures and give hours notice of turning up with prospective purchasers - it's not fair and it's not on. Morally and ethically he is out of line.

AdrianC

Rainy-Days wrote: »

You have answered your own question - anybody can see it on the internet, there is a difference in people coming to actually view a property which will be substantially less in number - you do know that don't you?

So what? Seriously... so what? People who see the pics on RM will not give the first toss about her sofa, except as a bit of set dressing. They're looking at the room. They make take the mick out of her sofa, if it's particularly hideous, but that doesn't make the slightest difference to her - and they'd do that after leaving the place once they see it in the flesh anyway.

That may well be the case that she decides to leave, but it is not up to the LL to make demands and she capitulates.

The landlord wants to sell the property.
To sell the property, the landlord needs EAs round, needs photos taken, and needs viewers round.
To sell the property, the LL needs vacant possession sooner or later.

If he can't get easily get the viewings and photos with her co-operation, then sooner starts to sound much more attractive than later. It really is that simple. And, yes, he can just give her notice. She's on a statutory periodic tenancy. Two months notice. Bye.

She is having to take Monday off work (at short notice) to accommodate him which frankly is out of order (because apparently he can't be bothered to arrange evening EA's viewings or so he claims).

She doesn't have to be present.

He can have an empty property with no rent for 12 months plus whilst he tries to sell.

Price the place right, it'll sell quickly - furnished or unfurnished in the pics. But it won't sell without photos and without viewings. He may well figure it's easier to have a more compliant tenant in, who's well aware when they move in of the fact that the place is on the market so it's going to be a shortish tenancy. Yes, the rent may be lower - but not half or less.

...demand that their effects are in pictures...

You still haven't said how you think the photos are going to be taken without her furniture in them...?

As a Landlord you can't just assume and take everything as a given right and you can't crap on your tenants, get them to take time off work... and give hours notice of turning up with prospective purchasers

He isn't being unreasonable here. He's made her aware that the place is on the market - she's agreed to viewings. He's given her what sounds like a week of notice of the EAs coming round. She does not have to be present, so she does not have to take time off work. In fact, it would make everybody's life (including hers) easier if she isn't present. She has no input to the sale process, and she has no stake in it.

Your friend, frankly, is sounding like a fruitloop.

PuzzledDave

I think you are missing the point Adrian. Her unclothed, naked furniture will be used by the landlord to sell his property - all those perverted people looking at RightMove can just gawp at all hours and do god knows what.

It doesn't seem so bad, if the furniture is making a discreet private show to some selected viewers who may want to take things further an purchase the home - but on the internet where there are no controls over what some degenerates might do with photoshop might do with them ?? It gives me the vapours to think about it.