We’d like to remind Forumites to please avoid political debate on the Forum.

This is to keep it a safe and useful space for MoneySaving discussions. Threads that are – or become – political in nature may be removed in line with the Forum’s rules. Thank you for your understanding.

PLEASE READ BEFORE POSTING: Hello Forumites! In order to help keep the Forum a useful, safe and friendly place for our users, discussions around non-MoneySaving matters are not permitted per the Forum rules. While we understand that mentioning house prices may sometimes be relevant to a user's specific MoneySaving situation, we ask that you please avoid veering into broad, general debates about the market, the economy and politics, as these can unfortunately lead to abusive or hateful behaviour. Threads that are found to have derailed into wider discussions may be removed. Users who repeatedly disregard this may have their Forum account banned. Please also avoid posting personally identifiable information, including links to your own online property listing which may reveal your address. Thank you for your understanding.
📨 Have you signed up to the Forum's new Email Digest yet? Get a selection of trending threads sent straight to your inbox daily, weekly or monthly!
The Forum now has a brand new text editor, adding a bunch of handy features to use when creating posts. Read more in our how-to guide

Leasehold and consent for alterations

Hello,

I'm in the process of purchasing a ground floor maisonette which has a conservatory extension. I'm unsure of the exact age but I've found a planning application indicating permission was granted for it in 2000. It was there when the current owners moved in (around 2003).

There is however no evidence they ever got permission for the alteration from the landlord. The lease states that permission is required for alterations (exact text below).

The lease is a very long term (999 years) and the ground rent is nominal, there is no service charge. From my reading of the lease the freeholder is expecting the leaseholders to deal with any buildings maintenance. From talking to the current owners they've only had one contact from the freeholder upon moving in. Otherwise it's just a PO Box company somewhere that receives cheques.

So the question is what to do and should I care about the potential lack of permission for the conservatory? I will of course discuss this with my solictor but I was wondering if anyone on here had some experience or advice they could share here?

Realistically it looks like the freeholder stays as hands off as possible. So it seem unlikely they'll come chasing me for permission (it has been 15 years and they haven't so far). So I'm pretty tempted to just ignore it. From what I've been reading online if you have a clause allowing alterations with permission they can't unreasonable withhold this and must make a reasonable charge. So if they did turn up asking to be paid for retroactive consent and this turned out to be £2000 say it would be annoying for me but by no means disastrous.

Lease text:
And also will not at any time make any alterations or additions of any nature whatsoever to the demised property or any part thereof nor to carry out any development thereto without the previous consent in writing of the Lessors.

Comments

  • Bump, any thoughts?
  • Shahni
    Shahni Posts: 124 Forumite
    The risk is small, especially if the conservatory has been standing for 15 years with no objections from the landlord.

    The CML handbook (which is basically lender's instructions to solicitors) says:
    5.11.2 If there is evidence of a breach and, following reasonable enquiries, you are satisfied that the title is good and marketable; you can provide an unqualified certificate of title and the breach has continued for more than 20 years without challenge, then we will not insist on indemnity insurance.

    As it is, the conservatory has been there for less than 20 years so a restrictive covenant indemnity policy may be the answer.
    My credit card: £148.07/£694.91 (21%)
    Partner's credit card: £0/£602.03

    Loan from partner's mum: £800/£2,400 (33%)
    Loan from partner's dad: £10,000/£10,000 (100%)

    Personal loan: £3,000/£3,000 (100%)
  • eddddy
    eddddy Posts: 18,553 Forumite
    Part of the Furniture 10,000 Posts Name Dropper
    edited 22 April 2015 at 2:42PM
    Presumably, your lease includes the land that the conservatory is built on (i.e. it has not been built on the freeholder's land).

    Fortunately, your lease includes this phrase:
    ...without the previous consent in writing of the Lessors.

    Even though it doesn't say so in the lease, this means that the following is implied:
    ... and consent must not be unreasonably withheld

    So unless the freeholder has a good reason to withhold permission, the worst case would be that you have to pay them a 'reasonable' admin fee to get consent. (Probably low hundreds of pounds.)

    The time that this sometimes happens is a when new 'aggressive' investor buys the freehold. The first thing they do is wander round looking for unauthorised alterations - in the hope of raising a few thousand in admin fees.

    Or your mortgage lender may insist on getting the freeholder's written permission now - in which case you should negotiate with the vendor about who should pay the fee.

    (Things would be much trickier if your lease simply said "no alterations".)


    Edit to add....

    I just re-read your post, and you seem to be aware of most of this anyway!!!
  • So unless the freeholder has a good reason to withhold permission, the worst case would be that you have to pay them a 'reasonable' admin fee to get consent. (Probably low hundreds of pounds.)

    The time that this sometimes happens is a when new 'aggressive' investor buys the freehold. The first thing they do is wander round looking for unauthorised alterations - in the hope of raising a few thousand in admin fees.

    Yes that's my primary concern but as said above if it's on the order of a couple of thousand whilst frustrating can be dealt with and sounds like it may well be less than that.

    Thank you for the advice.
This discussion has been closed.
Meet your Ambassadors

🚀 Getting Started

Hi new member!

Our Getting Started Guide will help you get the most out of the Forum

Categories

  • All Categories
  • 354.4K Banking & Borrowing
  • 254.4K Reduce Debt & Boost Income
  • 455.4K Spending & Discounts
  • 247.3K Work, Benefits & Business
  • 604.1K Mortgages, Homes & Bills
  • 178.4K Life & Family
  • 261.6K Travel & Transport
  • 1.5M Hobbies & Leisure
  • 16K Discuss & Feedback
  • 37.7K Read-Only Boards

Is this how you want to be seen?

We see you are using a default avatar. It takes only a few seconds to pick a picture.