'Is global warming happening?' Poll discussion/results

Foggy_Day

westernpromise wrote: »

The issue with this poll is that it conflates several quite separate views on global warming into "No, I don't believe it is happening". As such, it has already accepted the Chicken Littles' position even though it is precisely this that the sceptics object to. .

Member westernpromise gives a nice summary of some of the arguments and positions but begins strangely by accusing the questioner of conflation and of already having accepted "Chicken Little's position". What was the motivation for this? Perhaps I am missing something.
Foggy Day

gibby

Doh!

I cant believe anyone is daft enough not to see the problems all over the world with our selfishness for cheap goods, excessive foods etc

people & children are dying

in 3rd world countries upto 95% of the water is used for grazing
80% of grain is used for grazing
all for meat to be fed to the us & European customers

13 billion tonnes of waste is produced in this process
& 8 times more grain is used to feed the cattle than to feed the humans direct

wake up & stop making excuses

G

Bojangles_3

Why is the Ice cap melting? Why have we had sustained record high temperatures? What's causing the build up of rain, flooding and freak weather systems if it isn't global warming.

Someone says the sun gets hotter anyway - how the heck do you check that - stick a thermomiter in it..?! Surely the effects on earth attributed to the sun (or rather the depletion of the protection from it) is the only way to establish this.

You know what, even if global warming isn't happening, let's still aim to get Kyoto ratified, let's reduce the mass consumption of the earth's scarce resources, let's 'exploit' natural wind, sun, wave power (why the heck did we wait so long?!), let's reduce the crippling dependency on the car (people aren't so stressed, unfit and unhappy in nations where people of all ages cycle - look at Sweden/Holland/Belgium etc). Let's get 'big business' interested in 'sustainable development' - afterall, that's the ONLY single thing that's really going to change things,I think, for the better.

Does smoking cause lung cancer and carry other health risks and are cigs addictive? - YES!!! Evidence has been around for years, the tobacco industry pays BIG MONEY to 'keep the debate open'. Let's not wait 40 years over the global warming issue to say..'well, there's still room for doubt...'

superhoop

I just think the way the poll results are shaping up is very scary. At present over 40% of respondents think that Global Warming is not happening.

Everyone is entitled to their view, but what will it take to persuade people to change their minds?

Is it that people value their 'comforts' so much, e.g. the foreign holidays, the gas-guzzling 4X4s, the central-heating etc etc that they just won't accept they are the cause of the problem?

Badger_Lady

sharkmark wrote:

you can start by doing the simply stuff (lightbulbs, switch off TV) and in time work you way to cycling to work, using train/bus...becoming vegetarian (farm animals release a stupid amount of methane - another greenhouse gas!!!)...

I don't deny that these are good things to do - switching to renewable sources and reducing unnecessary energy consumption will benefit human life (yes, I am a bicycling vegetarian!), but I have not yet been convinced that this will reverse global warming.

Bojangles wrote:

Someone says the sun gets hotter anyway - how the heck do you check that - stick a thermomiter in it..?!

I'm not sure about measuring the sun's temperature, but we do have historical earth temperature readings for something like 16 million years. The one interesting chart Al Gore presented in his film was a history of temperatures, compared with a history of CO2 levels in the atmosphere. It showed that, according to the normal cycle, we are pretty warm at the moment but set to get warmer naturally. His concern was that, with CO2 levels at an all-time high, we would get far warmer that the normal cycle would normally take us.

bobbybee2 wrote:

if something isn't done soon to stop global warming, then the cost to put it right will be $9 trillion.

What would the $9 trillion be spent on? How do we, in fact, change the temperature of the entire planet? And how do we know that this action will not have an equally detrimental effect on the ecosystem?

Money_saving_Martyn

Bojangles wrote: »

Does smoking cause lung cancer and carry other health risks and are cigs addictive? - YES!!! Evidence has been around for years, the tobacco industry pays BIG MONEY to 'keep the debate open'. Let's not wait 40 years over the global warming issue to say..'well, there's still room for doubt...'

I have to agree, after all there's no smoke without fire, if you'll excuse the pun.

I'm not a scientist, and I suspect very few people on this board are (but there's no need to announce yourselves either way!), so it's always going to be difficult to make an informed decision. According to Al Gore's An Inconvenient Truth, there is a lot of evidence to counter the argument that temperatures have varied like this for centuries, but of course you have to bare in mind that that's his evidence for his argument (and he spends ages in his film driving around!)

Personally, I'd rather do my best now to save energy (and of course money!!! :money: ) by "doing my bit". If in 50 years time they say "oops, it wasn't Global warming" what will I have lost? I'll have cycled to work and become much fitter; I'd have saved £1000s (maybe!) in energy bills and been able to treat myself and my OH, who will still be at my side….

Although I understand buying things cheaply can also mean they were produced using high polluting factories in developing countries, and therefore an ethical style of shopping would be needed, saving energy, reusing and recycling, walking/cycling instead of driving and doing a little bit of back yard composting goes hand in hand with money saving :money: which is why we're all on this site....?

Why oppose it?

Badger_Lady

Money_Saving_Martyn wrote:

Why oppose it?

Oh, I don't oppose it, I just question the "facts".

As I said earlier, there are other benefits to doing "the right things", but as a naturally inquisitive person I resent being spoon-fed information that isn't explained properly or backed up with hard evidence. Part of me believes that the evidence must exist... but no-one's shown me yet!

Moneytiger

For what it's worth, my opinion is thus;

Global warming through climate change is happening however, this is nothing new to the planet. There have been innumerable times where this has happened before. How many ice-ages have there been? Remember the Vikings used to farm Greenland, England used to have many vineyards, etc and there is nothing we humans can do to prevent, slow, or reverse the process.

I am of the opinion that the argument for humans being the cause of global warming is nothing more than a bandwagon successive 'Western' governments have jumped on becuase it is a simple way of:

1. Justifying ever increasing taxes (and it is a lot easier to raise taxes than addresss the underlying causes of government spending!) and

2. Those same governments seek to protect national interests by attempting to prevent developing countries from exploiting their own natural resources or vigorously pursuing a course that would bring their economies up to that of the 'West'.

Yes, I have stopped using plastic carrier bags because I feel they fill up the ground, take too long to decompose, and are a risk to wildlife, but so far as global warming is concerned, I will simply turn up the air-conditioning in my 4x4, enjoy a number of foreign holidays each year, and pay the 'taxes' to compensate everyone for the life I have worked so hard for.

And the argument will run and run and run, and no doubt the humans-are-to-blame believers will shout the loudest.

Monti

davetrousers

teddyco wrote: »

I don't believe that 'man-made global warming' is a reality and I also don't believe that man evolved from a monkey or green slime. What I find amusing is how Darwin's 'Theory of Evolution' started out as just a 'theory' but somehow it has become 'fact' over the past hundred years and is being taught as 'fact' today.

Still no evidence of a 'missing link' to prove that we indeed evolved from monkey's. Although, just being around some people does give me cause to believe it.

It's amazing what people will believe because 'TV said that'.

Watch out there's a creationist about!

Man did not evolve from A monkey !!!!!!, but from apes, the evidence is substantial!

What 'missing link' is that?

Believe what you want to believe but don't disagree with the science because you can't be bothered (or simply just can't) understand it.

davetrousers

8harlosh8 wrote: »

Believe it or not, Global Warming is not due to human contribution of Carbon Dioxide (CO2). This in fact is the greatest deception in the history of science.We are wasting time, energy and trillions of dollars while creating unnecessary fear and consternation over an issue with no scientific justification!!We must remember that it is the Sun that determines our seasons, and thusly has a greater impact upon the climate than we could ever even try to achieve.Even the London Telegraph reported in 2004 that global warming was due to the sun being hotter than it has ever been in the past 1,000 years!!A group of scientists recently stated that the research behind Al Gore’s film and in fact, the concept of greenhouse gases causing global warming, is “a sham”. They claim that in fact, there is very little evidence to prove that theory, and that the evidence actually points to an increase in solar activity being the cause of climate change!!!

You are quoting data that is years out of date (20-30 years) regarding solar activity. In this time solar activity has reduced.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/6290228.stm