Ticket from First Parking - Not within bay markings

BrokeStudent91

Hi guys, I need some advice on what to do next.

I got a parking ticket from parking outside of a designated parking bay in the multi story car park at my uni. Basically, the car park was full and I parked in a space where there were no markings, but I was not blocking anyone in or blocking access for any vehicle. There was also another car parked in the same way next to mine as other people were doing the same thing. I paid for the time I was parked there, and when I came back found I had an £80 parking charge notice.

I went on the citizens advice website, and found that you can appeal on the grounds that the cost of the ticket was too high, and when I got the NTK through the post I appealed through the First Parking website using this argument. I did not tick the box stating that I was driving, and I used language such as "the car was parked" rather than "I was parked". I got the following email in reply:

Dear xxxxxxx

Re Parking Notice Number xxxxxxx
POPLA appeal verification code: xxxxxxx

We acknowledge receipt of your appeal, regarding the above parking charge. Parking at this site is only for vehicles that are parked in accordance with the terms and conditions, as detailed on the signage on site. This signage is clear, in line with industry standards and clearly details any charges that may be imposed, should these terms and conditions be breached.

I have now had the opportunity to review this case and my findings are:


After reviewing the photographic evidence and also your appeal information; on this occasion I will be rejecting your appeal. It is clear from the photographs that you are not parked within a valid bay. A warning has previously been issued to you for the same offence. First Parking have also ensured that their Parking Charge amount is not punitive and set on the basis of a strong commercial justification for charges of this nature. The charge is based on a pre-estimate of loss, and has been calculated using our company records. The Parking Charge amounts are calculated in conjunction with the landholder, and have been approved and prescribed by the British Parking Association. It should be noted that it is commonly held that any pre-estimate of loss need only be rough and ready.

I therefore uphold the operative's decision to issue this parking charge notice.

You now have a number of options from which to choose:

....

Their reply says that I have previously been warned about parking in unmarked bays but I have never had any kind of warning at all, written or verbal.

What is the next step? I've seen some good posts here about appealing to POPLA, what are my chances of winning if I do that?

nigelbb

BrokeStudent91 wrote: »

Their reply says that I have previously been warned about parking in unmarked bays but I have never had any kind of warning at all, written or verbal.

It's probable just the same template letter that they send to all keepers. It's already full of other lies like "amount is not punitive" & "charge is based on a pre-estimate of loss"

Redx

chances are you will win at popla, but its not guaranteed

better to try and win at popla as if you do the charge is cancelled, otherwise its 6 years of debt collector harassment

details are in post #3 of the NEWBIES sticky thread, including a link to popla examples

Dublindel

Did you get a POPLA code with the rejection letter

BrokeStudent91

I did get a POPLA code, I am drafting up a reply now using an example letter, if I post it here first could you guys check it over before I send it?

Redx

you should not be drafting any replies

you should be drafting a popla appeal to upload on the popla website

examples of these are found in post #3 of the NEWBIES sticky thread

you should also be checking the expiry date and validity of the 10 digit popla code on parking cowboys website

BrokeStudent91

Ok, yep I have checked the code already, it's valid and I have until 05 May.

I'm looking at the sticky thread now, I'm struggling to find cases similar to mine, but so far I've identified the following arguments I can use:

No GPEOL
Punitive charges
Keeper Liability

Is there anything else I can throw in? Anything about not receiving any warning?

What is the best way of wording the keeper liability argument since I haven't named myself as the driver?

Redx

add signage too

if you havent named the driver, keep it that way, assume I was driving and so keep the appeal in the vein of KEEPER

make it like a "no comment interview" , question everything , admit nothing, make them prove their case

generally speaking, what happened on the day is irrelevant, so it doesnt have to be like you case, just make up a generic appeal draft and post it for critique

think of it as like a thesis or homework, draft it and submit it for marking , dont expect the "teachers" to do it for you, its your job to come back with a draft appeal, not ours to make one for you free of charge, nor for us to do it for you

neil.net

A warning has previously been issued to you for the same offence

If this isn't true, I'd be inclined to include it in the appeal - makes their PCN and authority questionable!

First Parking have also ensured that their Parking Charge amount is not punitive and set on the basis of a strong commercial justification for charges of this nature. The charge is based on a pre-estimate of loss, and has been calculated using our company records.

The above is just their say so, it will be up to POPLA to decide that, their assertions are just there to dissuade argument on these points. This actually works against them, because now you know at least one of the factors they'll use to argue their case and can prepare for it!

enfield_freddy

Ok, yep I have checked the code already, it's valid and I have until 05 May.


that a long expiry time for a popla code , what date is the letter marked?




http://www.popla.org.uk/FAQs.htm


"We must receive your appeal within 28 days from the date of the operator’s notice of rejection. The date the operator sent the rejection to you will be on the appeal form."

The_Deep

You need to put them to strict proof that you have previous, if they cannot then their credibility is seriously compromised. Also, they are claiming commercial justification, this is penalty for an overstay or non-payment, but will not wash for parking outside of a bay, especially where you have paid the full amoun, and this is not a commercial car park anyway.

I therefore uphold the operative's decision to issue this parking charge notice.

Strange wording by the operator, it is as though they think they are the adjudicator.